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India’s caste system remains entrenched, 75 years after independence

economist.com

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Re: India’s caste system remains entrenched, 75 years after independence

#71

Post by whycombinatore »

vmception wrote: post #19

Can someone help me understand identity politics in India? There are a lot of things I don't understand, for example, there are some people that find it really important to tell others that the caste system doesn't exist, or is like really sensitive to anything negative said about India. Is that just run-of-the-mill nationalism? Because if so, it is hilarious when it's another country's nationalism.

Its very easy to understand. Broadly speaking, in any culture you'll find two types of people. 1. Those who question existing systems and accept the historical truths even if it doesn't paint their own identity in good light. 2. Those who will claim that their identity is awesome and will deny or shift blame for past injustices. You can see this literally everywhere.

Re: India’s caste system remains entrenched, 75 years after independence

#72

Post by whycombinatore »

amriksohata wrote: post #64
nyolfen wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

jatis have been endogymous for ~2000 years according to genetic studies. nowhere else on earth has this level of genetic segregation within a single region.

jatis yes, but not segregation, classification yes, not hierarchy on steroids until the british came in

Yeah right, every damn thing is because of someone else. Start taking responsibility for your actions.

Re: India’s caste system remains entrenched, 75 years after independence

#73

Post by whycombinatore »

pseudonymousgun wrote: post #41
raven108 wrote: post #21

India vedas talk about “varna” - class system based on ability & skills, not caste system. Modern Indian caste system was introduced by British to divide and conquer. Economist with a long history of Hindu phobia and in the vein of colonial British rake it up every now and then. Caste comes from Spanish casta, no equivalent term exists in sanskrit for this.

Not sure where you read these information, but makes no sense.

You don't "read" these type of information. You make them up to look good.

Re: India’s caste system remains entrenched, 75 years after independence

#74

Post by whycombinatore »

FabHK wrote: post #12

It's been a while that I've been to India (last millennium...). Back then, the Times of India had pages and pages of lonely hearts ads in the back, or rather, matrimonial ads. They were sorted by caste, though there were two special categories for NRI (Non resident Indians, i.e. expats) and MBA (yes, Master of Business Administration graduates) - they seem to transcend caste. The ads typically specified the industry…

To your last question, yes, those ads haven't changed one bit.

Re: India’s caste system remains entrenched, 75 years after independence

#75

Post by no_butterscotch »

yur3i__ wrote: post #9

Caste is so insane, in western diaspora communities its thankfully starting to die out though. My generation (3rd generation in the west) aren't really educated enough on traditions to know about caste or care.

I believe IBM (or Intel) plus some other Western companies have seen caste-based discrimination lawsuits emerge, whereas a couple decades ago that wouldn't have been the case.

The idea that the diaspora doesn't keep this stuff alive is false.

Re: India’s caste system remains entrenched, 75 years after independence

#76

Post by vmception »

whycombinatore wrote: post #71
vmception wrote: post #19

Can someone help me understand identity politics in India? There are a lot of things I don't understand, for example, there are some people that find it really important to tell others that the caste system doesn't exist, or is like really sensitive to anything negative said about India. Is that just run-of-the-mill nationalism? Because if so, it is hilarious when it's another country's nationalism.

Its very easy to understand. Broadly speaking, in any culture you'll find two types of people. 1. Those who question existing systems and accept the historical truths even if it doesn't paint their own identity in good light. 2. Those who will claim that their identity is awesome and will deny or shift blame for past injustices. You can see this literally everywhere.

yeah, when you say it like that it does seem consistent across cultures. the main thing for me is that I am unfamiliar with the connotations behind different last names in India, and I also cannot tell Indian subcultures apart visually if there are more nuanced ethnicities but I am becoming aware that this level of nuance is also at play

Re: India’s caste system remains entrenched, 75 years after independence

#77

Post by kylehotchkiss »

ramblerman wrote: post #22

This is a real risk when working with offshore teams in India. We had to get involved in the interview process multiple times as the talent is absolutely there. But left to their own devices a lot of the sites ended up hiring friends or "cousins". I'm not sure if that came down to Caste or just "you scratch my back, and I'll scratch yours" but it was far from meritocratic.

The talent is definitely there but working with Indian startups - Zomato, Flipkart, Ola, Byjus, etc. More interesting work for people than outsourced projects. Try finding alumni from Indian startups and they’d know how to hire and likely have connections with talented individuals to start.

Re: India’s caste system remains entrenched, 75 years after independence

#78

Post by yur3i__ »

no_butterscotch wrote: post #75
yur3i__ wrote: post #9

Caste is so insane, in western diaspora communities its thankfully starting to die out though. My generation (3rd generation in the west) aren't really educated enough on traditions to know about caste or care.

I believe IBM (or Intel) plus some other Western companies have seen caste-based discrimination lawsuits emerge, whereas a couple decades ago that wouldn't have been the case. The idea that the diaspora doesn't keep this stuff alive is false.

A lot of tech workers are first generation immigrants though, I'm talking about more entrenched immigrant families that are 2 or 3 generations deep

Re: India’s caste system remains entrenched, 75 years after independence

#79

Post by dTal »

foolinaround wrote: post #47

there is a cream segment of the Dalits and certain castes that got categorized as 'lower' based on their influence at the time of Indian Independence that benefited from the affirmative actions, and they are now as influential as 'brahmins' their progeny continue to reap the benefits at the cost of the rest of their own caste members. This segment actually rules India - the Brahmins continue to hang in there, but don…

It's the standard cycle of revolution. Middle class convinces lower class to help overthrow upper class. Middle class becomes new upper class. Most successful from the lower class rise until they eventually become the new middle class, and begin to chafe against the upper class.
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