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GM tells some Bolt owners to park 50 feet away from other cars

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Re: GM tells some Bolt owners to park 50 feet away from other cars

#171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've heard that this is the reason that all the future major lithium ion companies have already been founded. Learning all the really hard lessons about QC and how to prevent fires and defects takes more experience and knowledge and time than any new competitor could devote to catching up.

That’s not how these industries work. The new kids on the block start with talent, largely hired from the more established players.

Well, good luck hiring away enough of a team in the foreseeable future... That's one of the major bottlenecks in the industry at the moment.

Re: GM tells some Bolt owners to park 50 feet away from other cars

#172
post #51

My perception of American designed and engineered vehicles is that they’re really awful, not just from a reliability standpoint but also from a user interface standpoint. GM, Ford, and Chrysler haven’t been building good vehicles in my lifetime - once I switched to Hondas I’ve yet to have any serious engine trouble even in some very old vehicles, whereas every American car I’ve owned has been a money sink. Of course…

Not sure where you're coming from. IMO, the Bolt UI is as good as it gets. Physical HVAC, steering wheel and volume controls, Apple Carplay and Android Auto on a decent sized touchscreen.

I just got a new Toyota and the UI is absolutely horrible, the steering wheel button ergonomics are bad.

Re: GM tells some Bolt owners to park 50 feet away from other cars

#173

So what is a family with a two car garage supposed to do, park the Bolt a block away? This seems like the kind of thing GM should get wayyyy in front of with a very generous offer to buy back the cars as a trade towards another GM model.

The article says they've announced a recall, so I assume this advice is for people who have chosen not to send the car back yet. edit: no, I'm confused. From another article: > The Detroit automaker has recalled all of the roughly 142,000 Bolts sold since 2016 because the battery can catch on fire. GM has taken a $1.8 billion charge so far for the cost of the recall and has been buying cars back from some disgruntled…

It just means that they've acknowledged the problem and issued a recall notice. To the best of my knowledge they haven't repair any yet and don't intend to conduct a mass buyback.

Re: GM tells some Bolt owners to park 50 feet away from other cars

#175
post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that actually relevant though, or just an implementation detail? Perhaps you could argue a moving car seems more potentially hazardous? But then that's only learned from extant behaviour anyway?

A car being driven is guaranteed to have a person behind the wheel. (For now...) A electric car in an attached garage spontaneously bursting into flame at 2 am is a recipe for burning a house to the ground.

The major issue in these fires is the lack of someone attentive. We can leverage the existing horn in the same way as anti-theft systems to fix that. We need a way to detect the issue, but I would hope there's a thermometer somewhere we can use to sense dangerous thermals.

Even more interestingly, the car could communicate with your smoke detectors to set off the fire alarm. It would be a great value proposition for something like Nest. It can let you know that there's going to be a fire before it even starts.

I would hope that honking the horn in case of fire is something we could achieve with a software update, but maybe not.

The pipe dream would be for the car to be able to get itself somewhere safe-ish in bad conditions. We're probably a good ways off from it, and safer batteries may take over first, but worst case scenario we may be able to program some kind of "escape path" into the cars. My car has the ability to save garage door opener codes. It's not too far fetched to be able to tell it to roll up the garage door and pull out into the driveway in case of potential fire situations. You might need an automatic ejector for the charger cable, but that doesn't seem insurmountable either.

I do agree that electric cars are more dangerous for now, and will continue to be even after the updates. We can narrow that gap with software, and even more with some integrated hardware.

It's not all doom and gloom for EVs, though.

Re: GM tells some Bolt owners to park 50 feet away from other cars

#176
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think there's the 5 second cool factor but after that novelty you're probably just as disgruntled as the fact that you lost 35% of the range for your car. I hope the Chevy bolt is a rare case and stories like this don't pop up with the other upcoming electric vehicles. The new lightning F150 looks very attractive.

I think it would be good. If you drive your car or charge it out of those ranges it can catch on fire. Removing that area of "ordinary things you can do with your car and it might make it burn up" is exactly why that is important to consider. There must be hundreds of thousands of bolts and at least some of those customers have not heard about this. The other side of it is hey you took something away from my car and…

> There must be hundreds of thousands of bolts

99,356 in USA & Canada, per this number: https://www.goodcarbadcar.net/chevrolet-bolt-sales-figures-u...

I was curious about this so I looked it up, you might think it is interesting too.

Re: GM tells some Bolt owners to park 50 feet away from other cars

#177
post #4

> The automaker told Bolt owners to limit the charge to 90 percent, plug in more frequently and avoid depleting the battery to below about 70 miles of remaining range. Tesla's approach here would be to issue an OTA update that told your car to treat 90% as 100% and 25% as 0. I can't decide if I like that better or worse.

I think practicality is governing each company’s choice; there’s no way GM is capable of pushing an OTA update to change all those cars’ firmware. If they could push an update over cellular, I would bet you GM would do it in a heartbeat.

Both GM and Ford have OTA updates on their modern cars. They just don't do it very often. The upside of Tesla pushing an update every week is they're good at it.

Re: GM tells some Bolt owners to park 50 feet away from other cars

#178
post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. Moreover, the issue isn't new cars today. You know when you saw that old Chrysler Grand Caravan burning on the side of the road, and you hear the story that the person has been holding it together solely with thoughts and prayers and maybe $500 between tires and oil for the last 7 years of its 19 year life? That's the current inevitability. I'm not worried about someone's 6-month old Bolt or 2-year old Model 3.…

> Germany is starting to standardize on towing an electric car away to dunk it in a tank to ultimately handle fires. I suppose if the problem is widespread enough, every city will have a mobile dunk truck at the ready for electric vehicle fires.

And what do you do if those fires cause other things to burn in the vicinity?

Re: GM tells some Bolt owners to park 50 feet away from other cars

#179
post #121
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reduced mpg is not all that much though, maybe 2-3 mpg nothing nearly as significant as driving behavior on mpg. A small displacement honda is going to have good mpg all its life unless something has really fouled up.

I've noticed a 5mpg decrease with every car I've owned in pretty similar driving conditions over 5-10 years and immaculate maintenance.

That can’t be right, it would leave your cars immobile after like 6 years, and getting half the range out of a tank after 3 years.

Cars are good for 20 years still going roughly as far on a tank as they did. I’ll believe 10% loss of mpg over a lifetime, I don’t track that closely, but 10-20% range loss on a tank per year, nahhh.

Re: GM tells some Bolt owners to park 50 feet away from other cars

#180
post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but an important part of that context is that electric car fires also burn longer and hotter and take significantly more effort to put out. Too little water can actually make the fire worse. Annecdotally, my recollection from other articles is that electric cars do in fact catch on fire less often. But it also seems like they may be more difficult to deal with. This may change as EV's become more mainstream & fi…

Yep. Moreover, the issue isn't new cars today. You know when you saw that old Chrysler Grand Caravan burning on the side of the road, and you hear the story that the person has been holding it together solely with thoughts and prayers and maybe $500 between tires and oil for the last 7 years of its 19 year life? That's the current inevitability. I'm not worried about someone's 6-month old Bolt or 2-year old Model 3.…

Towing the car in a tank seems a sensible solution, but I'm wondering if it wouldn't be simpler to tow the tank near the vehicle, lift it and dunk it there?
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