Why Don't Rich People Just Stop Working? • Hacker News Board

Re: Why Don't Rich People Just Stop Working?

#81

Post by ghaff » Wed, Sep 15, 2021, 4:23 PM UTC

jcelerier wrote: post #56

HWR_14 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But that's not the option open to the uber-rich. Look at Tom from MySpace. He took a ton of money and is on a permanent vacation. He certainly seems to have a more enjoyable life than Zuckerberg. Although I guess he cannot afford the biggest yachts in the world.

> He certainly seems to have a more enjoyable life than Zuckerberg. heh, Tom's life (according to https://www.hellomagazine.com/travel/2020111645793/tom-myspa... ) would have myself commit seppuku in three weeks. I can barely stand five days of "do nothing productive" vacations. Would definitely choose "testify in front of congress" instead.

I wouldn't call being a travel photographer "doing nothing." After all, it's what some people do for a job. Personally, I'd probably get tired of it myself but he doesn't seem to be just laying around a beach all day.

It doesn't seem fundamentally different from taking up sculpture or painting.

Re: Why Don't Rich People Just Stop Working?

#82

Post by genericone » Wed, Sep 15, 2021, 4:23 PM UTC

lbriner wrote: post #41

racl101 wrote: post #16

I find that rich people, like the millionaires and billionaires, are driven people and driven not necessarily only by money. Extreme financial success is but a side effect of whatever is driving them whether it be building a huge company or a revolutionizing and industry. And if getting rich is not the end game whether entirely or partially then the work is never done. They are still on a mission and there are more c…

We had a talk once from a man who had sold his company at around 23 years old for several million, a lot to a young man. He said he thought he would live the dream, travel the world, go and do whatever he wanted, waking up at 10am every day and having a cooked breakfast! Then he realised how boring and lonely it was. His friends were all at work while he was "free" and most people don't want to sit by themself at a b…

Getting shit done with the team feels great, agreed. I guess our hunter-gatherer group mentality is holding us back from simply enjoying fruits of labor.

Re: Why Don't Rich People Just Stop Working?

#83

Post by HWR_14 » Wed, Sep 15, 2021, 4:24 PM UTC

duxup wrote: post #67

randycupertino wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what gift did you recommend for the grandchildren?

CEO asked us about it too. We discussed the pros and cons of laptops vs desktops and etc (this was when laptops were still a big tradeoff vs a desktop in power and etc). IIRC we recommended a nice desktop for the kids that could be upgraded / changed they were inclined but also plenty useful if they chose not to. Also told him to get a nicer monitor than they were thinking.

> e recommended a nice desktop for the kids that could be upgraded / changed they were inclined

This seems to be where you probably mislead him. If the CEO is making enough money, you buy a new computer, never bother upgrading. Depends on how much he wants to spoil his grandkids (the answer is usually too much.)

But yes, people spend a lot of time on specs and completely neglect the monitor.

Re: Why Don't Rich People Just Stop Working?

#84

Post by jdc0589 » Wed, Sep 15, 2021, 4:24 PM UTC

this was a good read, its definitely a weird societal position.

Most people's spending catches up, or at least increases, with their wealth. Completely ignoring the whole keeping up with peers aspect (who are also wealthy now) and even power/wealth craving, most people aren't content just realistically living within the perpetual means provided to them by their accumulated wealth. Additionally, a lot of people that think they'd be content not working and living a simpler life, actually aren't when they give it a try.

I'm extremely biased, but I always end up citing hobbies as the problem and solution in this kind of situation. Ask a friend what they'd do if they didn't have to "work" any more. Most of them are going to tell you that they have no clue and haven't thought about it, or tell you about something that isn't actually feasible to be your primary activity without a steady traditional income stream.

I'm mostly talking about people that barely qualify for this discussion in the 1-5m wealth range. As mentioned in the article, this is generally plenty to satisfy general FIRE requirements, and even tradition retirement requirements. But most people in that wealth range would also have to change their lifestyle to safely make retirement happen, and that's a tough sell when most people get their dopamine fix and sense of enjoyment/relaxation from expensive vacations, fancy dinners, new cars, new gadgets, stuff directly tied to spending money with no return.

Re: Why Don't Rich People Just Stop Working?

#85

Post by kangnkodos » Wed, Sep 15, 2021, 4:24 PM UTC

"Many people with a large amount of money, perhaps a million or two, consider themselves middle class when clearly they could even retire and live off their passive income"

If you have a million dollars, stop working, invest the money, you can safely draw about 35K per year for a long time. This is based on long term historic returns of the stock market.

There are different definitions of middle class in the US. The first one I found, Pew 2019, said the range was 46k - 137K.

So living off the passive income of a million dollars puts you well below middle class.

Re: Why Don't Rich People Just Stop Working?

#86

Post by docflabby » Wed, Sep 15, 2021, 4:24 PM UTC

What else would they do instead?

I think most people with unlimited financial backing would pursue what truely interests and excites them, might be projects, more money, parties, power. Money buys the freedom to do that.

Theres plenty of stories of people inheriting money and just spending it all on partying and hedonism. And others where they just study in education their whole life.

Re: Why Don't Rich People Just Stop Working?

#87

Post by ttyprintk » Wed, Sep 15, 2021, 4:24 PM UTC

burkaman wrote: post #21

Well they sort of do, in that they usually stop working for other people and stop working on anything they don't enjoy. If you're rich enough that you can design your own "job" and delegate anything you don't want to do, it's not really the same concept that most people associate with "work".

I think that’s an easy approach for the purposes of conversation. Work includes both innovation and toil. What is stopping you from hiring someone to take care of your toil?

Re: Why Don't Rich People Just Stop Working?

#88

Post by pasquinelli » Wed, Sep 15, 2021, 4:24 PM UTC

jkepler wrote: post #70

pasquinelli wrote: post #14

rich people get rich from other people's work. so if the rich "work" it's to pretend that that isn't the arrangement; to maintain the illusion that they work for their money rather that owning the surplus value created by their workers.

Your statement was only true prior to the invention of capitalism. After capitalism, its possible to gain wealth without stealing it from workers. Capitalism is more nuanced than many say it is---see the Rerum Noveram by Pope Leo XIII for an intro to the nuance of the issue: he warned owners not to abuse worker, but also called workers not to destroy property of owners or other individuals. Oppression and wage-theft…

you can't pay a worker as much money as they make for you, because then the business would have no profit. the profits are distributed to the owners; their ownership comes from paying for it, not from working for it, that's what the word capitalist means.

Re: Why Don't Rich People Just Stop Working?

#89

Post by bittercynic » Wed, Sep 15, 2021, 4:25 PM UTC

pasquinelli wrote: post #42

lake_vincent wrote: post #8

The answer is always classes, folks. Because once you become a millionaire for the first time, you leave the middle class and realize that you are actually quite poor amongst the millionaire class , so you have to keep working to climb through the ranks of millionaires. It's a recursive algorithm, you see.

that's not actually what classes are. class is not just a braket of incomes, it is a role in economic production. if you get your money by trading your work for it, you're working class. if you get your money by virtue of what you own, you're capitalist. a bit of both is what middle class is.

This is my preferred understanding of class as well, but I've noticed that my conversations are more enjoyable if I don't try to insist others use the term the 'right' way.

Re: Why Don't Rich People Just Stop Working?

#90

Post by HWR_14 » Wed, Sep 15, 2021, 4:26 PM UTC

randycupertino wrote: post #74

DamnYuppie wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not going to say there isn't some aspect to that but once you get $5,000,000-$10,000,000 in the bank the interest alone will dwarf almost any salary. So you could kick back and let compounding interest do the trick. In my social circle I know of 3 people in that bracket and all of them are working. It isn't so much for the money they like being mentally and socially engaged while working on problems that interes…

When I worked with a billionaire and several millionaires at a private equity firm, everyone was jealous of and struggling to make it to the next level up. The guy who made $250k and a 200k bonus was jealous of the guy who made a $2million dollar bonus. The $2 million dollar bonus guy was mad he only flew first class and didn't take net jets everywhere like the senior partner. The Senior Partner was annoyed he took n…

> If you have enemies in life, consider encouraging them to get really into horses because imo it's the fastest way to drain their time and assets with little return.

It's up there with owning a megayacht and collecting art.