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Vaccine experts: Covid-19 booster shots aren't needed now

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Re: Vaccine experts: Covid-19 booster shots aren't needed now

#511

Post by sterlind »

joshuamorton wrote: post #452
ApolloFortyNine wrote: post #418

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You just said it's not fair to compare mask mandated rates, but then compare against the flu, which obviously is affected by the mask mandates (also mask mandates right now in the US are a bit of a joke, have you seen a sports game recently?).

The point is that comparing un-masked flu rates to masked-covid rates isn't valid. Comparing masked-flu to masked-covid is valid. Of course, if you're doing that comparison, it may also be worth mentioning that the flu also has a vaccine and if you're vaccinated against the flu too, its less dangerous than covid.

both comparisons are useful to me. masked covid vs. masked flu shows how dangerous covid is in relative terms, masked covid vs. unmasked flu shows how dangerous covid is compared to the risks I used to take.

Re: Vaccine experts: Covid-19 booster shots aren't needed now

#512

Post by refurb »

RHSeeger wrote: post #316
refurb wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What you call lifestyle changes I call “need to make a decision”. Patients make terrible healthcare choices all the time. If we’re going to hammer them on vaccines let’s go all in, huh? Obesity causes massive costs and burden on our healthcare system yet I don’t see people calling them idiots.

A lifestyle change is something that you need to actively pursue forever. It's not just a one time decision and action. I can't tell if you're being intentionally obtuse, or you actually can't see the difference. And yes, all the issues listed are ones that can (usually) be corrected by action of the person involved. But the _level_ of action is on a totally different scale.

Then we agree - these are are healthcare choices where people fail to make the right one?

Re: Vaccine experts: Covid-19 booster shots aren't needed now

#513

Post by somewhereoutth »

beamatronic wrote: post #310
tzs wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you have a vaccine, then your risk of death is far below that of the flu (statistically). That seems worth checking. US flu deaths per year over the last 10 years ranged from 12000 to 61000, averaging 35900 [1]. That's 3.7 to 18.6 per 100k, averaging 10.9 per 100k. Weekly COVID deaths among vaccinated people is 0.1 per 100k [2]. The flu season is typically about 8 months. A weekly death rate of 0.1 per 100k over…

Any kind of equivalence statement to the flu is a well-known conservative "dog whistle"

Not only that, but it is part of the concerted campaign by the right to downplay Covid. They would very much prefer the poors to suffer and die quietly - without stopping work of course.

Re: Vaccine experts: Covid-19 booster shots aren't needed now

#514

Post by spookthesunset »

baumy wrote: post #478
spookthesunset wrote: post #354

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I absolutely adore when publicly available data sourced from government agencies gets downvoted. Since March of 2020 any kind of statement suggesting covid isn’t as bad as some make it out to be is met with fierce vitriol. The number of times I’ve been called “dangerous” for posting well sourced data that clearly shows the IFR of covid is not 1-2%… It’s as if people believe that any good news will result in others “n…

I remember when I first saw that USC dataset, it was mind blowing. Any public health official worth their salt should be absolutely horror struck that the public's perception of the risk profile of a disease is off by multiple orders of magnitude. Their entire job is to accurately inform the public about public health risks, and that dataset is proof that they've failed more spectacularly than I would have thought po…

You expressed my exact thoughts better than I ever could hope to. Thanks!

Re: Vaccine experts: Covid-19 booster shots aren't needed now

#515

Post by dgfitz »

amrocha wrote: post #509
dgfitz wrote: post #455

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That isn't accurate. The media doesn't disagree with me, the country is ripped in two over COVID and vaccines, there is no denying that. Why do you say they disagree? Edit: capitalization Second edit: I didn't say the WAR united the country. You're twisting my comment.

The war was a direct response to 9/11, they're directly related, just like vaccines and mandates are a direct response to COVID. The country was ripped in two back then two, you just didn't hear about it as much. I was wrong when I said the media disagrees with you though. Maybe the difference is that the anti-vax side has managed to organize through the internet and has gotten a lot more coverage, so they look bigge…

> The war was a direct response to 9/11, they're directly related, just like vaccines and mandates are a direct response to COVID. The country was ripped in two back then two, you just didn't hear about it as much.

I understand the point you’re trying to make, but I still disagree. I was in high school when 9/11 happened, I remember it well. There was a period of time, I will admit it was on the order of 48-96 hours, where this country was as united as I’ve ever experienced. COVID could have had that same effect, us as country(wo)men against the world. It didn’t. From the jump it was politics. I’m sure you remember Harris and Biden saying they wouldn’t get a vaccine when Trump was president. It’s political all the way down.

Re: Vaccine experts: Covid-19 booster shots aren't needed now

#516

Post by refurb »

spywaregorilla wrote: post #234
refurb wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Calling the unvaccinated idiots is about as effective as calling the obese, alcoholics, people who don’t take their medication, etc, idiots. Apparently we have sympathy for people who fail to make good health choices except for the unvaccinated. Not effective at all.

If someone were struggling with alcoholism, and I offered them an FDA approved shot to remove their addiction to alcohol, I would consider them fairly stupid if they refused it. Handling diseases and addictions is a long term struggle, not similar to a one time choice at all. It is orders of magnitude easier to get a covid shot than to rid yourself of an addiction.

Ok, but would you call them an idiot? That’s my point. Do you think calling them idiots makes them more or less likely to make the right choice?

Re: Vaccine experts: Covid-19 booster shots aren't needed now

#517

Post by adolph »

ufo wrote: post #486
adolph wrote: post #479

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a trial subject is exposed to virus and the vaccine works to trigger an effective immune response, how does PCR know the difference between virus molecules neutralized by vaccine response and those neutralized otherwise?

In those cases the virus particles don't replicate enough to be detected.

How is a difference be determined between between vaccine enhanced immune response, normal immune response and not exposed?

Re: Vaccine experts: Covid-19 booster shots aren't needed now

#518

Post by marcosdumay »

hef19898 wrote: post #445
marcosdumay wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hum, anyway they are making a lot of effort to sell doses around here (Brazil), even with an uncooperative government. And they indeed are asking for a smaller price than on the developed countries. I guess the rich countries applying a 3rd dose is a net benefit for them, but they seem to be playing the "we will sell as much as we can" game, not the monopolizer "restricting supplies leads to more lucrative prices" on…

These strategies are not mutually exclusive, are they?

You either sell as much as you can or you restrict how much yo sell. You can't do both.

Re: Vaccine experts: Covid-19 booster shots aren't needed now

#519

Post by ufo »

adolph wrote: post #517
ufo wrote: post #486

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In those cases the virus particles don't replicate enough to be detected.

How is a difference be determined between between vaccine enhanced immune response, normal immune response and not exposed?

The basic structure of a phase 3 vaccine efficacy trial is that you give the vaccine to half of the volunteers and placebo to the other half. Then you you wait for them to naturally be exposed to COVID. When a pre-determined number of infections is reached, the data is unblinded and they compare how many infections happened in the vaccine group vs the placebo group. If less people are infected in the vaccinated group then it shows that the vaccine is effective.

Re: Vaccine experts: Covid-19 booster shots aren't needed now

#520

Post by [deleted] »

shapefrog wrote: post #475
junon wrote: post #468

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. Even here in Germany it's a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" scenario. It's entirely polarized.

You cant tell the truth because it will just be 'fuel for the anti-vaxers'. Not telling the truth being also fuel for the anti-vaxers.

[deleted]
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