Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

wsj.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

451–460 of 687 posts

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#451

Post by richwater »

mikeyla85 wrote: post #423
rg111 wrote: post #66

I don't blame Facebook (or Twitter, or any particular company) for this. We can only blame scale . Some things are much more scalable than others, and "beauty" scales. And the "occurrence of beauty" does, too. Before the advent of scale on almost every aspect of our lives, a local musician or theatre group found easy income. Now, since after the invention of gramophones, more people can listen to less and less musici…

Hard disagree. Facebook does not need to optimize profit and growth in every product decision. They make choices about what to amplify, knowing the consequences of those choices.

> They make choices about what to amplify, knowing the consequences of those choices.

You think Facebook specifically crafts algorithms to make teen girls self-conscious...?

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#452

Post by richwater »

revel wrote: post #153
everdrive wrote: post #117

Facebook is an accelerant. The movie "Mean Girls" largely predated social media and highlighted many of the same issues. This seems to be a pretty ingrained issue, although I think most people agree that Facebook makes it worse. Here's a theory that's nearly guaranteed to land me in hot water: Why are young girls so awful to each other? I don't think it's unreasonable to suspect that is has to do with "hormones," new…

Can we please not react to this article by immediately blaming teenage girls? You have an article that shows one of the most powerful corporations in the world exploiting teenagers to boost revenues and lying about it in testimony before congress. That's the story.

> exploiting teenagers

Anyone, at any time, can stop using Facebook or Instagram with 0 repercussions.

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#453

Post by standardUser »

rg111 wrote: post #66

I don't blame Facebook (or Twitter, or any particular company) for this. We can only blame scale . Some things are much more scalable than others, and "beauty" scales. And the "occurrence of beauty" does, too. Before the advent of scale on almost every aspect of our lives, a local musician or theatre group found easy income. Now, since after the invention of gramophones, more people can listen to less and less musici…

I see a much more diverse display of beauty these days than I ever did in the 80's and 90's. There is a conscious effort by a lot of people to broaden beauty standards in recent years, and a larger appetite from people to see different standards in media. I think a lot of this is due to more women in positions of influence and power across fashion and media, including a lot of women who grew up on the hyper-narrow standards of the late 20th century.

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#454

Post by atonalfreerider »

wussboy wrote: post #186
aspaviento wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The less I want is to defend Facebook but I think lately people don't want to acknowledge their own responsibilities. It's like every time there is a problem, the cause is someone/something else. I don't think Instagram is impossed to anyone. Young people can feel the pressure to use it because their friends use it but they aren't forced to do so. From the article it seems that young girls know about the toxicity in…

I have a personal grudge against anyone saying "Why don't the parents take some responsibility to combat a multi-billion dollar company who puts the resources of small countries in to making their children behave in detrimental ways." But I'll not get in to that. :) Facebook and Instagram are drug dealers. Sure, they're not physically distributing a substance, but the social interactions they provide are every bit as…

Ditto for online pornography. And unlike chemical drugs that have to be transported and administered, these images and videos fly through the wires into childrens' bedrooms.

I know, because like most children, I was exposed to online porn at a young age and was addicted to it well into my adult life. These companies need regulation, because they are bad actors.

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#455

Post by tester756 »

standardUser wrote: post #449

It used to be that if you were queer - in any sense of the word - and lived in one of the countless small, conservative, traditional communities in this country, you were shit out of luck. Now, thanks to the internet, there exists inclusive and positive communities for people of every type of background and experience. This simply did not exist for most people just a few decades ago, but now it's accessible to almost…

How about numbers / net outcome?

If we trade 10 good things for 10 000 terrible, then is it worth?

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#456

Post by dontblink »

standardUser wrote: post #449

It used to be that if you were queer - in any sense of the word - and lived in one of the countless small, conservative, traditional communities in this country, you were shit out of luck. Now, thanks to the internet, there exists inclusive and positive communities for people of every type of background and experience. This simply did not exist for most people just a few decades ago, but now it's accessible to almost…

Could minorities who need connection still find that connection via forum-based communities (i.e. pre social media)?

Social media was helpful for me to connect with lost acquaintances (which was novel at first, but now I barely continue to converse with them if at all).

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#457

Post by berkes »

standardUser wrote: post #449

It used to be that if you were queer - in any sense of the word - and lived in one of the countless small, conservative, traditional communities in this country, you were shit out of luck. Now, thanks to the internet, there exists inclusive and positive communities for people of every type of background and experience. This simply did not exist for most people just a few decades ago, but now it's accessible to almost…

Is that really so? Has this been researched over longer periods?

I'm honestly curious, because I'm probably biased when I think about medieval inquisitions or 1930 Race theories. Was, say, a black person in Rome treated bad because of racism? Were Jews hated in ancient early Muslim cities? Were there no same sex couples in, say, a 1500 village at the swedish coast? I can imagine many 'queer' were just accepted as such in many communities throughout the world, throughout the ages. But I can just as well imagine it being literally deadly to be even a little out of line, just as well.

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#458

Post by stickfigure »

tester756 wrote: post #455
standardUser wrote: post #449

It used to be that if you were queer - in any sense of the word - and lived in one of the countless small, conservative, traditional communities in this country, you were shit out of luck. Now, thanks to the internet, there exists inclusive and positive communities for people of every type of background and experience. This simply did not exist for most people just a few decades ago, but now it's accessible to almost…

How about numbers / net outcome? If we trade 10 good things for 10 000 terrible, then is it worth?

According to another commenter here, the research that spawned the WSJ article said Instagram made 41% feel better, 31% worse, and no impact for the other 28%.

I haven't found the original material to verify, but if this is accurate, seems like the net outcome argument works in Instagram's favor.

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#459

Post by uniqueid »

standardUser wrote: post #449

It used to be that if you were queer - in any sense of the word - and lived in one of the countless small, conservative, traditional communities in this country, you were shit out of luck. Now, thanks to the internet, there exists inclusive and positive communities for people of every type of background and experience. This simply did not exist for most people just a few decades ago, but now it's accessible to almost…

  It used to be that if you were queer - in any sense of 
  the word - and lived in one of the countless small, 
  conservative, traditional communities in this country, 
  you were shit out of luck.
As bad as that was, in the past you could move to another of the 380,000 towns on this planet.

Today, if your social media trail renders you unemployable (or the target of persecution) there's no longer any corner of the planet to which you can escape.

Edit: People seem to be misinterpreting my meaning entirely. By 'unemployable' I was thinking of, for example, racy photos. By 'persecution' I mean actual IRL stalking/assault etc. The kind of example I had in mind was, say, a racy photo from Pride Parade following someone around for the rest of their living days, preventing them from working at certain lawfirms, or attracting the attention of some violent psycho.

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#460

Post by tnzm »

smithza wrote: post #369
SamoyedFurFluff wrote: post #360

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Parental control cannot and can never be used as a singular or even more influential factor to societal level problems. Parents can have all the best intentions in the world but if the society they’re trying to raise children in is broken, they can’t protect those children forever.

It isn't about protection . It is about values and moral principles. Parents can teach children tools about self control and mindfulness about evaluating if things are good for them or not. Teens and young adults have to explore and figure out their place in the world apart from their parents, but the skills and values taught are often transcendent of the shifting values in culture.

Let's face it, powerful forces in our society discourage self-control and critical reflection, and culture encourages people to have children regardless of whether they have learned those skills
Post reply on HN