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Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

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Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#371

Post by franga2000 »

ysavir wrote: post #302
franga2000 wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is also disingenuous, since they could've gotten the tree cut down without the nuke and so the nuke has no "exclusive" positive value. Social networks have some positive value that is exclusive to them, like the ability for people to connect with friends as well as diverse groups of strangers - both things that would otherwise be much harder if not impossible for many.

Exclusive to social networks... And restaurants, bars, parks, meetup groups, local events, email lists, chat servers (eg Discord), and generally taking the time to meet your friends and family in person rather than on the web. It's only "much harder if not impossible" for lack of trying. And while yes, there are some out there that simply don't have such options, we also have people that need to cut down a tree but c…

Because in reality, all friends and family totally live withing reasonable travel distance of each other and interesting people will always pop into your local bar at the exact time you're there and wear a shirt outlining why you should spend your time trying to meet them as opposed to literally anyone else in the bar.

Email lists and chat servers are just Facebook with extra steps. The only difference ends up being the fact that Facebook-like social networks suggest you people and content you might like from a giant pool, whereas the alternatives have rather limited pools and the signal to noise ratio is pathetic because you get literally everything that is posted and have to filter through it manually.

Don't get me wrong, I hate Facebook and only use it on maybe a handful of occasions per year, but you can't tell me that it didn't enable things that weren't possible for many before it was invented.

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#372

Post by bumby »

aspaviento wrote: post #246
afavour wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you teach your kids not to consume drugs, why Instagram should be any different? Imagine if all the other kids at school used drugs on a daily basis, that there was advertising plastered everywhere telling you that drugs are cool, that successful people use drugs and that your worth in this world can be directly tied to successful use of drugs. I don't mean to sound mean here, but are you a parent? If not I susp…

I don't want to use myself as an example because it's just my experience but when I was young people around me smoked, many of my teachers smoked and in TV and movies smoking was still accepted as something approved by society. But I was taught not to do it and never did it. With this I just want to say that I know it's a difficult task but presenting it as a lost battle/impossible seems to me wrong.

I know you probably intuit this based on your pre-emptive caveat about anecdotal evidence, but a quick online search seems to indicate that your experience may not be the norm.

"Peers’ smoking is the strongest predictor of adolescent smoking."[1]

[1] Gecková, A.M., Stewart, R., van Dijk, J.P., Orosová, O.G., Groothoff, J.W. and Post, D., 2005. Influence of socio-economic status, parents and peers on smoking behaviour of adolescents. European addiction research, 11(4), pp.204-209.

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#373

Post by bserge »

andreime wrote: post #106
blakesterz wrote: post #2

https://archive.is/egPlc “The research that we’ve seen is that using social apps to connect with other people can have positive mental-health benefits,” CEO Mark Zuckerberg said at a congressional hearing... “We make body image issues worse for one in three teen girls,” said one slide from 2019, summarizing research about teen girls who experience the issues. “Teens blame Instagram for increases in the rate of anxiet…

I'm not defending Facebook and I just had some thoughts reading the quotes and am curious what you think of them. 1. I remember that while growing up fashion magazines, actors/actresses and I want to say peer pressure (but am fearful its incorrect) were a big source of body image issues. 2. Maybe it's a side effect of our society or "normal" to have security issues while growing up. We've been having good childhoods…

It's definitely normal to blame everything and everyone but yourself for your problems.

In some cases, it's justified, but the vast majority of time it's just avoiding responsibility.

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#374

Post by treis »

pfortuny wrote: post #296
blakesterz wrote: post #2

https://archive.is/egPlc “The research that we’ve seen is that using social apps to connect with other people can have positive mental-health benefits,” CEO Mark Zuckerberg said at a congressional hearing... “We make body image issues worse for one in three teen girls,” said one slide from 2019, summarizing research about teen girls who experience the issues. “Teens blame Instagram for increases in the rate of anxiet…

"Using social apps to connect with other people can have positive mental-health benefits" That statement cannot be false because it is devoid of any content, being a mere hypothetical. The fact that it is surrounded by "research" is meaningless as well, as the aforementioned sentence is like saying "the elements of the empty set fulfil all properties"... So no, they are not contradicting themselves. They are simply a…

The research the GP's quote is referencing said Instagram made 41% feel better, 31% worse, and no impact for the other 28%. It's not clear why that can be used as evidence that it makes some girls feel worse about themselves but that it makes some girls feel better about themselves.

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#375

Post by franga2000 »

syshum wrote: post #321
franga2000 wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is also disingenuous, since they could've gotten the tree cut down without the nuke and so the nuke has no "exclusive" positive value. Social networks have some positive value that is exclusive to them, like the ability for people to connect with friends as well as diverse groups of strangers - both things that would otherwise be much harder if not impossible for many.

Usenet, IRC, Forums all connected friends and diverse groups over the internet before "social media", and IMO they did not have the same negative effects because they did not "gamify" the system with a reward feedback loop like the current social media systems do

None of them had nearly the same reach and discoverability as Facebook does. Good luck finding your childhood friend whose name you barely remember through thousands of web forums with primarily pseudonymous users. Meanwhile, Facebook's recommendation engine will just throw their name at you out of nowhere.

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#376

Post by malfist »

deepfriedrice wrote: post #201
Tarsul wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

there was this absolutely devastating graphic about rising suicide rates of teen girls which coincided with mobiles and especially instagram. Sorry can't find it right now.

The cdc [1] has some figures that show a remarkably clear trend upward after ~2007. But IIRC it's pretty even across gender. [1] https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/databriefs/db352-h.pdf

Facebook might be asking girls where their body image issues came from, but boys/men are not much different.

It's reasonable that if one gender is developing self esteem issue from a social network, then the other gender _probably_ is too.

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#377

Post by bserge »

aspaviento wrote: post #131
andreime wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not defending Facebook and I just had some thoughts reading the quotes and am curious what you think of them. 1. I remember that while growing up fashion magazines, actors/actresses and I want to say peer pressure (but am fearful its incorrect) were a big source of body image issues. 2. Maybe it's a side effect of our society or "normal" to have security issues while growing up. We've been having good childhoods…

The less I want is to defend Facebook but I think lately people don't want to acknowledge their own responsibilities. It's like every time there is a problem, the cause is someone/something else. I don't think Instagram is impossed to anyone. Young people can feel the pressure to use it because their friends use it but they aren't forced to do so. From the article it seems that young girls know about the toxicity in…

I just said the same thing ha.

Yeah, it is difficult for people to admit they're at fault.

Blame is justified only when someone is forcing you to do something or keeping you from something.

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#378

Post by germinalphrase »

zepto wrote: post #276
muglug wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The places with the highest gun crimes are also the places with the toughest gun laws Only in America. Other western nations have tough gun laws and also low gun crime, because you can't hop in your car and pick up a gun in a neighbouring state. And actually the correlation is only seen in parts of America. New York City has tough gun laws, comparatively low gun crime and a lower homicide rate per capita than the r…

> because you can't hop in your car and pick up a gun in a neighbouring state. You can’t do this in America either. You can only buy guns legally in your state of residence.

There’s no paperwork or background check on a private sale, so it’s almost a meaningless distinction.

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#379

Post by [deleted] »

bthrn wrote: post #6
blakesterz wrote: post #2

https://archive.is/egPlc “The research that we’ve seen is that using social apps to connect with other people can have positive mental-health benefits,” CEO Mark Zuckerberg said at a congressional hearing... “We make body image issues worse for one in three teen girls,” said one slide from 2019, summarizing research about teen girls who experience the issues. “Teens blame Instagram for increases in the rate of anxiet…

Mark’s use of the word “can” is what makes it technically not perjury.

[deleted]

Re: Facebook knows Instagram is toxic for teen girls, company documents show

#380

Post by bserge »

wussboy wrote: post #186
aspaviento wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The less I want is to defend Facebook but I think lately people don't want to acknowledge their own responsibilities. It's like every time there is a problem, the cause is someone/something else. I don't think Instagram is impossed to anyone. Young people can feel the pressure to use it because their friends use it but they aren't forced to do so. From the article it seems that young girls know about the toxicity in…

I have a personal grudge against anyone saying "Why don't the parents take some responsibility to combat a multi-billion dollar company who puts the resources of small countries in to making their children behave in detrimental ways." But I'll not get in to that. :) Facebook and Instagram are drug dealers. Sure, they're not physically distributing a substance, but the social interactions they provide are every bit as…

> And this is why I don't blame the users.

Not even a little? Users aren't brainless, as much as they'd want to make you believe.

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