Earlier quoted context omitted.
It has a bit of a double meaning. Starting with the Ivy Bridge (3rd) generation, Intel switched to using thermal paste between the core and heat spreader instead of solder on socketed desktop processors. Presumably this was done as a cost savings measure. This caused a marked increase in core temperatures and thermal throttling. Enthusiasts discovered that you could remove, or "delid", the heat spreader and replace t…
Cost saving would've been to get rid of the IHS entirely. Their mobile chips work fine without them, I don't really understand why they're a thing for desktop processors. AMD uses them too, so there must be a reason... is it because they're afraid of improper installation breaking them? That's on the user. The weight of the desktop heatsinks? Small changes to latch design should suffice. Or you can have a metal space…
Intel is reducing server chip pricing in attempt to stem the AMD tide
171–180 of 344 posts
Re: Intel is reducing server chip pricing in attempt to stem the AMD tide
#172Earlier quoted context omitted.
TSMC are spending about that every year for the next 3 years on production improvements. Chip fabrication is so expensive to develop, I'm concern that $24bn is nowhere near enough to build a 5nm process.
Intel has 24bn available in cash. One could assume Intel also has $FOO x 24bn available in loaning power.
money can't buy node process. Intel struggle with 10nm for so long and 7nm is delayed while TSMC is now 5nm production ready and developing 3nm.
Re: Intel is reducing server chip pricing in attempt to stem the AMD tide
#173Earlier quoted context omitted.
I agree in principle, but it's pretty obvious that this would be bad for their profit margins and as a consequence wouldn't happen. After all, making your consumers buy the more expensive versions of your product just because they need one of its features is a sound business decision. Otherwise people will use the cheaper and lower end versions if they only need these features - like i'm currently using 200GEs for my…
Well, now they are losing to AMD, so what does that tell you about it being a sound busineas decision?
Exactly. It seemed like a sound business decision because it gave them measurably more money in their pocket over a short period of time. They don't appear to have taken into account that they left the door open for competition. It wasn't just prices that left them vulnerable, but it sure didn't help.
AMD should never have been able to get back in the game.
Re: Intel is reducing server chip pricing in attempt to stem the AMD tide
#174Earlier quoted context omitted.
> is it because they're afraid of improper installation breaking them? Yes. This was an issue back in the Athlon Thunderbird days. "It's on the user" doesn't work as an argument when all of your large desktop/server OEMs notice a large uptick in failure rate post-assembly.
Looking back it seems so barbaric. I remember how they briefly tried those black foam sticker pads in the corners of the substrate before acquiescing and using the IHS. At some point they realized they could do better than a heatsink mounting system that involved trying to balance a heavy metal object on a small pedestal while trying to hook a tensioned spring to a clip you couldn't see by exerting tremendous downwar…
I always wondered why that mounting mechanism even existed. Would've thought it would get scrapped on the drawing board but maybe no one in the design pipeline ever put a screwdriver through their motherboard.
Re: Intel is reducing server chip pricing in attempt to stem the AMD tide
#175Earlier quoted context omitted.
Apple produces one A series chip for the iPhones every year. How does that work?
Baseless speculation: perhaps they do actually throw away chips? They only really target a premium market segment so perhaps it's not worth it to their brand to try and keep those chips.
Turns out the Apple tax means you're also buying the three chips thrown away to produce your one...
Re: Intel is reducing server chip pricing in attempt to stem the AMD tide
#176foundry ecosystem forced Intel's hand. we going to see more and more company developing its own chip and outsourced to TSMC and Samsung for production.
Intel's chip no longer fit what the market needs. Apple M1, YouTube own video-transcoding chips, AWS's graviton and Google's own chip for pixel 6.
we have reach the point where off the shelf chip isn't going to fit the problem we are trying to solve. the ability to make custom chip that fit your product/bottleneck is more important than the price and the Foundry ecosystem is reducing the custom chip cost.
i hope Intel IDM 2.0 can take off. we need more foundries that can do high end node.
Re: Intel is reducing server chip pricing in attempt to stem the AMD tide
#177Earlier quoted context omitted.
Wait till you find out that two people side by side on an airplane may pay 10x or more difference in ticket price, for the same ride.
Such as some airlines having a “business/first class” that’s nothing but “board before the plebs”
No, the scenario is that there are massive price differences even for the same class of seats. Traditionally, the major long haul airlines sold seats weeks/months in advance at rates that were basically losing money but made almost all of their per flight profit on last minute bookings at higher rates. These were usually business flights, but not necessarily (not usually, even) business class.
Business models for budget airlines (RyanAir, etc.) are a bit different but that's not relevant here.
Re: Intel is reducing server chip pricing in attempt to stem the AMD tide
#178Earlier quoted context omitted.
> And on the server front, which I'm sure is what's keeping them in business now, they face an existential threat in the form of ARM. HPC and inertia. Lots of inertia.
Intel has soundly lost HPC to NVidia at this point. Not only because of NVidia GPUs, but also because NVidia bought Mellanox (who makes those fancy InfiniBand NICs that those supercomputers use). Intel's Xeon Phi didn't work out so hot. They're working on Intel Xe (aka: Aurora Supercomputer), but Aurora has been bungled so hard that Intel's losing a lot of reputation right now. Intel needs to deliver Aurora if they w…
A lot of stuff in HPC still doesn't utilize GPUs (because the problem is not amenable to GPU architecture or laziness / lack of funding and interest) so at least for commercial deployments with a diverse set of solvers I'd say CPUs remain important. Intel might be unable to outperform their competitors at this time, but they have more than enough money to be temporarily cheaper to (seemingly) make up for that.
Re: Intel is reducing server chip pricing in attempt to stem the AMD tide
#179Earlier quoted context omitted.
They aren't losing to AMD because of market segmentation, they are losing because their fabs are way behind TSMC.
> they are losing because their fabs are way behind TSMC. I don't believe it is merely an execution problem. AMD's out-innovated Intel Evidence being the pivot to multi-core, massive increased PCIe, better fabric, chiplet design, design efficiency per wafter, among others. Why did this happen? > Two years after Keller's restoration in AMD's R&D section, CEO Rory Read stepped down and the SVP/GM moved up. With a docto…
Thanks! I had no idea about any of this. Very informative.
Re: Intel is reducing server chip pricing in attempt to stem the AMD tide
#180Earlier quoted context omitted.
Baseless speculation: perhaps they do actually throw away chips? They only really target a premium market segment so perhaps it's not worth it to their brand to try and keep those chips.
Turns out the Apple tax means you're also buying the three chips thrown away to produce your one...
That's not really an Apple tax though, that's a cost of doing business tax. It's not like Intel and AMD and everyone else aren't effectively doing the same exact thing.