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Steve Wozniak announces private space company to clean up space debris in orbit

independent.co.uk

11–20 of 264 posts

Re: Steve Wozniak announces private space company to clean up space debris in orbit

#11
post #5

It will be interesting to see how they are planning to earn money. The only ones willing to expend resources on space cleanup right now seem to be ESA (the European Space Agency).

Maybe they will also become an insurance company to insure satellites from spatial debris.

Re: Steve Wozniak announces private space company to clean up space debris in orbit

#12
post #5

It will be interesting to see how they are planning to earn money. The only ones willing to expend resources on space cleanup right now seem to be ESA (the European Space Agency).

I think that will change very quickly when we have a collision in space. I imagine SpaceX, for instance, would be pretty interested in cleaning up space junk if two of their LEO satellites collide.

Re: Steve Wozniak announces private space company to clean up space debris in orbit

#13

This space stuff is such a waste. There is enough garbage on the surface of the earth to worry about. Just nerd grifting IMO.

The issue with space debris is that on our current trajectory, at some point in the future, there will be so much debris traveling so fast that future space exploration will be impossible because we'll never get anything off the planet. Not to mention we won't be able to have satellites. Possibly a nerd grift but the issue is important.

Re: Steve Wozniak announces private space company to clean up space debris in orbit

#14
I'm very skeptical of the technical challenges associated with this problem (business model and financing aside). The amount of delta-v required to perform maneuvers to repeatedly "dock" with different pieces of space junk, and then again to de-orbit is very high. You MIGHT be able to de-orbit on the order of magnitude of ~10 pieces of low-earth orbit debris per mission. Maybe. If you're really good. And low-earth orbit junk isn't the major issue since it will de-orbit naturally in a reasonable time-frame. Higher orbit junk is what really matters, and will require much more delta-v to reach, and then again to de-orbit after "docking".

Allow me to blindly speculate here: a space-junk company is going to take one of the two following paths:

1) Perform low-earth orbit missions to de-orbit a few pieces here and then there, use the good PR to drive funding (let's just assume they can make the finances work via getting governments to pay for it or something). It will technically work, but it will only deorbit pieces that would naturally decay anyways at a meaninglessly low-volume. But the PR will be good and regulatory capture will ensure their investors get paid. The real problem will remain.

2) Go after the really big pieces in higher orbits. These pieces tend to be well-tracked and aren't really a large problem, but all the same outcomes in option 1 will occur. Investors will get paid, and of course, the real problem won't be solved.

Maybe I'm being pessimistic, but I see space-junk removal companies largely relying on the general public's lack of knowledge on how orbits work to drive PR. Maybe Kerbal Space Program 2 will go viral enough to fix that problem? We can only hope

Re: Steve Wozniak announces private space company to clean up space debris in orbit

#15

This space stuff is such a waste. There is enough garbage on the surface of the earth to worry about. Just nerd grifting IMO.

Space debris is exponential. It only takes one piece getting a good hit on a satellite to create thousands more.

Re: Steve Wozniak announces private space company to clean up space debris in orbit

#16
post #5

It will be interesting to see how they are planning to earn money. The only ones willing to expend resources on space cleanup right now seem to be ESA (the European Space Agency).

I think that will change very quickly when we have a collision in space. I imagine SpaceX, for instance, would be pretty interested in cleaning up space junk if two of their LEO satellites collide.

Pretty sure that SpaceX is enough of an environmental disaster already that they won't care.

Re: Steve Wozniak announces private space company to clean up space debris in orbit

#17
post #8
post #6

What is their business model? This is far from first space debris cleanup company, but regardless of their technical capabilities, all of them are useless until the regulations introduce a requirement for the launch providers and satellite owners to clean their mess.

Presumably, government contracting. Your satellite crashes? Pay us to clean it up.

or don't, and leave it there?

Re: Steve Wozniak announces private space company to clean up space debris in orbit

#18
So here's a potential business model for this: salvage rights.

When ships sink, the owner generally still retains ownership of any property. Sometimes the location of the wreck is known. Sometimes it needs to be found. It can cost a lot of money to find a wreck and recover any property.

So salvage rights are a principle of maritime law such that whoever does this is entitled to a reward commensurate with the value of the goods recovered (eg 10%).

I imagine there are orbital slots that are essentially unusable because of space debris (eg Project West Ford [1]). If orbital slots are sufficiently scarce then these could have value. At some point it may become commercial to spend the effort cleaning up an orbit and making it available. Companies could then be compensated for the value they create this way.

I do believe this will still require a dramatic decrease in launch costs, as in orders of magnitude more. But we'll see.

My personal belief (and hope) is that the future of getting into orbit is orbital rings [2]. If so, that completely changes the game because cleaning up an orbit essentially becomes a problem of just holding up a giant "paddle" (for lack of a better word) that is fixed to a point on Earth (essentially) and just letting the debris hit it.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_West_Ford

[2]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LMbI6sk-62E

Re: Steve Wozniak announces private space company to clean up space debris in orbit

#19

I'm very skeptical of the technical challenges associated with this problem (business model and financing aside). The amount of delta-v required to perform maneuvers to repeatedly "dock" with different pieces of space junk, and then again to de-orbit is very high. You MIGHT be able to de-orbit on the order of magnitude of ~10 pieces of low-earth orbit debris per mission. Maybe. If you're really good. And low-earth or…

Highly plausible analysis. Hopefully Woz is above the PR stunts and has a real plan for addressing the future problem (it's not really a problem yet, but it will be).
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