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Ergo IRC Server

ergo.chat

41–50 of 54 posts

Re: Ergo IRC Server

#41
post #37

Looks like HN front page for a few days is full of 90s IRC, Torrent, eMule and Usenet related posts. Wondering what's causing it.

Yesterday was a big "Think back 20 years!" kind of day for a lot of people in the US.

Twenty years ago, we had... well, actually, just about all of the internet features we take for granted today, though video wasn't nearly so nice, and we didn't have all of it in our pockets (though we still had perfectly good cell phones that let us talk to people and lasted multiple days on a charge, plus would generally bounce down a flight of stairs and laugh off the damage). We could talk to people across the planet, share documents (somewhat, Google Docs wasn't a thing yet), view websites, publish and read other people's content in a "social" sort of way (LiveJournal, MySpace, etc), and... it was still something you did in discrete time chunks, as opposed to the aether literally everything was mediated through.

Fast forward twenty years, and we still do the same, but now almost all of it is being intermediated by companies that have a desperate drive to monopolize absolutely as much of your attention as they can claw away from the rest of your life, and they more often than not have access to you, 24/7, no matter where you are, via your cell phone.

LiveJournal didn't pester you to log in because someone you met once at a party had a birthday, don't you want to come scroll? It was nicely chronologically ordered, so you could instantly tell if there was anything new to read (vs the random reorder "slot machine" interface that is the modern version), and you had to click to the next page at the bottom of each page, instead of a bottomless bowl of "feed."

And we did it on a fraction the computing power that phones have, but... it worked. We didn't need 8GB of RAM and 500MB of disk to run a single chat client, we ran Pidgin or Adium or something and connected to all the chat services at once, with a far better interface than the current siloed hell that is text communication on the internet (IRC, of course, remains a turtle and is unchanged from the 90s, ignoring the really weird explosion of Freenode and a new domain that everyone uses instead of Freenode now).

Just because stuff is new doesn't mean it's better, and I think more and more people, and even people deep in the modern tech ecosystems, are realizing that something has gone very, very wrong in the past 20 years of internet development.

Yes, unfathomable amounts of money have been made - but at the cost of literally everyone's attention, and with an awful lot of collateral damage to just about every aspect of life. It's increasingly harder to pretend that it's been a significant improvement in quality of life.

And, now, even those devices that promised connectivity are turning against their users. Win10 is a telemetry platform that also runs apps. Win11 is an advertising delivery platform that, based on recent bugs, breaks core fundamental OS functionality like "the start menu" if certain ads are delivered from a remote server. And of course sends God knows what upstream, won't let you have an offline account at all anymore if you buy the "home" version that's fine for most people, etc. Apple has decided that your device should be responsible for scanning for known-bad content (and, yes, they then decided that they'd back off for a while in the face of bad press, but they've yet to say they're not going to do it, just not quite yet. Cynically, one might observe that they're concerned about the holiday sales season coming up that is traditionally their strong quarter).

I've been opting out of a lot of the modern tech stuff in my personal life, and other than remembering just how painful endless group text chains were on flip phones, it's... mostly fine. I've gone back to a flip phone (that lasts most of a week on a charge), I now check email with actual mail clients that I check a few times a day instead of constantly, and my engagement with the internet has dropped massively. It's been really, really nice.

Re: Ergo IRC Server

#42
post #41
post #37

Looks like HN front page for a few days is full of 90s IRC, Torrent, eMule and Usenet related posts. Wondering what's causing it.

Yesterday was a big "Think back 20 years!" kind of day for a lot of people in the US. Twenty years ago, we had... well, actually, just about all of the internet features we take for granted today, though video wasn't nearly so nice, and we didn't have all of it in our pockets (though we still had perfectly good cell phones that let us talk to people and lasted multiple days on a charge, plus would generally bounce do…

Also, with centralization came a loss of diversity. It was easier to find video content in my native language (French) on eMule than it is on youtube.

And yes, I feel nowadays I devote a CPU core and a few GB of RAM to just text messaging. I hope that Matrix and its bridges can end that at one point.

Re: Ergo IRC Server

#43
post #18

Cool, but is anyone using IRC day to day in 2021? Not trying to be snarky, I'd love to, just don't know where I'd be.

Lots of people use IRC still. Libera being probably the biggest.

The overwhelming majority of F/OSS project communities I enjoy are on Libera or OFTC. IRC has real staying power among tool users.

Re: Ergo IRC Server

#44
post #26

Probably no relation at all to https://ergodex.io/ but was just reading today about it for the first time ever and this popped up on HN frontpage with a similar name

Ergo just means "therefore" in Latin.

In greek, the word "ergo" means "work". As a Greek myself, it seems like this etymology is much more common and used.

Similarly, when we say that something is ergonomic, it derives from "ergo" + "nomic" which means distribution of work. Distribution of work typically minimizes fatigue and that's also the meaning when we are talking about ergonomic chairs, keyboards, etc.

Re: Ergo IRC Server

#45
post #4

Honestly if I was starting again I’d set up a single Oragono[0] instance and be done with it. Other software might be excellent (inspircd), but it’s a hard sell to bring a new type of server unless it solves a specific problem. EDIT : Oragono has been renamed and is now this. Leaving here because the world should bask in my foolishness

Personally I go with ngircd, it is an apt-get install away every time.

Re: Ergo IRC Server

#46
Seems to support all the new IRC features. What's the best client to get all of those features? For the terminal and GUI on Linux. Or for Windows.

Re: Ergo IRC Server

#47
post #42
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yesterday was a big "Think back 20 years!" kind of day for a lot of people in the US. Twenty years ago, we had... well, actually, just about all of the internet features we take for granted today, though video wasn't nearly so nice, and we didn't have all of it in our pockets (though we still had perfectly good cell phones that let us talk to people and lasted multiple days on a charge, plus would generally bounce do…

Also, with centralization came a loss of diversity. It was easier to find video content in my native language (French) on eMule than it is on youtube. And yes, I feel nowadays I devote a CPU core and a few GB of RAM to just text messaging. I hope that Matrix and its bridges can end that at one point.

The flagship Matrix client, Element, is just as bad as any other Electron app. :( The alternatives (Nheko and such) don't tend to support the full feature set.

Re: Ergo IRC Server

#48
post #47
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, with centralization came a loss of diversity. It was easier to find video content in my native language (French) on eMule than it is on youtube. And yes, I feel nowadays I devote a CPU core and a few GB of RAM to just text messaging. I hope that Matrix and its bridges can end that at one point.

The flagship Matrix client, Element, is just as bad as any other Electron app. :( The alternatives (Nheko and such) don't tend to support the full feature set.

Yep, but despite this Matrix is superior in several key aspects: - One client, even like Element, allows you to access several networks. I think that having just Element instead of Slack+Telegram+Signal is already a CPU saver - lightweight and CLI clients exist, and do so LEGALLY with the full support of the protocol maintainers.

Re: Ergo IRC Server

#49
post #2

https://ergo.chat/nope >Copyright © 2019-2021 Daniel Oaks >Copyright © 2019-2021 Shivaram Lingamneni https://danieloaks.net/ is behind this. Notice all the companies associated with Ergo IRC Server are the same as those that are associated with Andrew Lee and the freenode take-over and death. shells.com londontrustmedia handshake.

Based on the responses below it looks like what you posted was nothing more than innuendo—actually a smear, given that you singled someone out by name. That counts as a personal attack and that is not allowed on HN. Please don't do this again.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Ergo IRC Server

#50
post #49
post #2

https://ergo.chat/nope >Copyright © 2019-2021 Daniel Oaks >Copyright © 2019-2021 Shivaram Lingamneni https://danieloaks.net/ is behind this. Notice all the companies associated with Ergo IRC Server are the same as those that are associated with Andrew Lee and the freenode take-over and death. shells.com londontrustmedia handshake.

Based on the responses below it looks like what you posted was nothing more than innuendo—actually a smear, given that you singled someone out by name. That counts as a personal attack and that is not allowed on HN. Please don't do this again. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

I think you're a bit confused here. Please refer to how danieloaks himself commented, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28505861

>It's totally fair to make that link, but I very explicitly told everyone over at LTM/H (including PIA and Handshake) that Oragono/Ergo and ircdocs were not work projects in any way. And while I was working on Shells.com, I was very explicit that I wouldn't be touching any IRC stuff for money while there. ... But yeah, it's definitely good to be wary of these kinda links, given what happened to snoo's and fn/libera's team.

I wanted to know what was going on and I didn't want to accuse him of anything since, like it turned out, he was aware of Andrew Lee's behavior and took proactive actions to prevent legal exposure to him. This wasn't some smear campaign. This was me worrying about a dude that worked at 3 different Andrew Lee IRC companies while developing Ergo and prominently displayed them on his website linked from the Ergo page. It's an issue he himself said he was careful about and worth addressing. After he cleared the air I even tried joining the IRC server to check it out.

I know you have to be proactive too to prevent personal attacks but I think in this case you're a bit off the mark.

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