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Uber must employ its drivers, Dutch court rules

nltimes.nl

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Re: Uber must employ its drivers, Dutch court rules

#11

Post by Loic »

kfk wrote: post #10
elgfare wrote: post #7

Uber says the majority of drivers don't want this, which I'd call bs on, but has anyone heard from actual drivers what they want?

I think Uber might be right here. EU labor laws protect a few but over a certain salary they are not very appealing. In Italy paying a net salary of 2,000 euros will cost the company 6000+. Things included like pension are not worth their cost, a private pension is better and cheaper, same for health services. It’s unfortunate but it’s true.

For the company it costs more money, but for the employee, you are way better being employed than contractor.

This is not a surprise, this extra money is effectively bringing the employee health insurance, pension, invalidity pension, unemployment benefit, maximum number of hours to work per week, paid vacations, etc.

If you need to pay it out of your pocket, it turns out to be the same.

In the "old" Europe, the net salary is basically 50% of the cost for the company, sometimes a bit more, sometimes less depending of marital status, country, etc. But this is a good rule of thumb.

Re: Uber must employ its drivers, Dutch court rules

#12

Post by airza »

sktrdie wrote: post #6

Bit out of context but I just came back from US (living in Netherlands). Holy flipping hell that place is full of cars. Literally everywhere. I mean I understand using a car upstate New York where things are further apart and everyone has a huge isolated villa. But do you really need 4 lane roads in freaking manhattan? Seems like regulating "car stuff" in general is always a good thing if you ask me.

There is a great youtube channel called "Not just bikes" which talks about urban planning in the netherlands and how it results in much more livable cities than the US.

Re: Uber must employ its drivers, Dutch court rules

#14

Post by ianleeclark »

bserge wrote: post #13

Why doesn't Uber employ them and guarantee minimum wage, anything extra is a bonus? Is it just the extra employee costs on the company side?

If you do such a thing, then you need to start worrying about local labor laws, vacation time, healthcare in the US, sick leave, etc. The gig economy works by circumventing these things.

Re: Uber must employ its drivers, Dutch court rules

#15

Post by drstewart »

pjmlp wrote: post #2

I love when US companies get to learn our unions and work laws are actually to be followed upon.

Yeah, it's the environmental and corruption laws you get to skirt in Europe! Just ask VW, FIFA, or any bank. So much more progressive.

Also: https://www.ft.com/content/5b986586-0f85-47d5-8edb-3b49398e2...

Re: Uber must employ its drivers, Dutch court rules

#17

Post by bserge »

Loic wrote: post #11
kfk wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Uber might be right here. EU labor laws protect a few but over a certain salary they are not very appealing. In Italy paying a net salary of 2,000 euros will cost the company 6000+. Things included like pension are not worth their cost, a private pension is better and cheaper, same for health services. It’s unfortunate but it’s true.

For the company it costs more money, but for the employee, you are way better being employed than contractor. This is not a surprise, this extra money is effectively bringing the employee health insurance, pension, invalidity pension, unemployment benefit, maximum number of hours to work per week, paid vacations, etc. If you need to pay it out of your pocket, it turns out to be the same. In the "old" Europe, the net…

I can see the future: "New EU law: for every multipurpose robot in operation, the company must employ one human" :D

Re: Uber must employ its drivers, Dutch court rules

#19

Post by yawaworht1978 »

kfk wrote: post #10
elgfare wrote: post #7

Uber says the majority of drivers don't want this, which I'd call bs on, but has anyone heard from actual drivers what they want?

I think Uber might be right here. EU labor laws protect a few but over a certain salary they are not very appealing. In Italy paying a net salary of 2,000 euros will cost the company 6000+. Things included like pension are not worth their cost, a private pension is better and cheaper, same for health services. It’s unfortunate but it’s true.

I have paid the ridiculous charge from Rome's airport to the city, it's interesting how many measures airports like Rome, Madrid, Barcelona have to take to keep Uber out as good as possible. I still agree with the Dutch court. First, EU has a goal to somewhat harmonize some laws and taxes. Europe should not simply allow any company to come along and undermine everything. If Europe let's this happen, the consequence is very simple, in case the drivers don't make ends meet, they will claim it from social services, making me the guy who pays for that. So taxpayers are subsidiaries to uebers shenanigans, no thanks. I support the European tax system and social policies, but I am not gonna pay the SV salaries for some "wise guys", I prefer the taxes invested in infrastructure, health care, the useful things, including pensions.if I would prefer the US model, I would go and live there.

Re: Uber must employ its drivers, Dutch court rules

#20

Post by chrisseaton »

sktrdie wrote: post #6

Bit out of context but I just came back from US (living in Netherlands). Holy flipping hell that place is full of cars. Literally everywhere. I mean I understand using a car upstate New York where things are further apart and everyone has a huge isolated villa. But do you really need 4 lane roads in freaking manhattan? Seems like regulating "car stuff" in general is always a good thing if you ask me.

I can't understand who would want to drive in Manhattan. Like where are they coming from and where are they going? Where do they intend to park when they get there? It wouldn't occur to me in a million years to attempt to drive into a metropolis like that. I see normal private cars driving through New York and London and can't imagine who is in them and what they're attempting to do that means their best route is through a city.
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