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Why did the web take over desktop and not mobile?

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Re: Why did the web take over desktop and not mobile?

#201

Post by imbnwa »

dukeofdoom wrote: post #177
anonu wrote: post #82

Also, what we call "mobile" is actually just 2 nice walled gardens with doors called "App Store" and "Play Store". That's at least another reason why the web is not pervasive on mobile: Apple and Google are quite happy that it's not that way because they can monetize their platforms with far more control than through the browser. The article references app stores pointing out that they reduced user friction in paymen…

A good open successor to flash would have made the app stores much less appealing. But that never happened.

I worked with a company middle of last decade that had to port its Flash content to Canvas and friends, its not even close the power Flash provided, not to mention the content development ecosystem surrounding Animate. Like, yeah, go ahead and export Canvas content from Animate, but be prepared for highly unoptimized Canvas runtime code.

Re: Why did the web take over desktop and not mobile?

#202

Post by bonoboTP »

Fragoel2 wrote: post #71

I found the article really hard to read, the author took a long and convoluted path to expose his ideas. As for the question that the article raises, there are probably many co-occurring reasons, and a lot of comments make good points. However, one that I couldn't find listed is IMHO performance. I still find web apps (and web sites) to feel really sluggish and slow on everything that is not a top-tier phone. Again,…

It's quite typical in this Malcolm Gladwell-style guru-writing. Start with some obscure non-business-related factoid story that demonstrates how intelligent and widely read you are an then give your opinion on the topic of business and hustling dressed in the aforementioned story. People write entire books where each chapter rehashes this formula.

Re: Why did the web take over desktop and not mobile?

#203

Post by [deleted] »

Retric wrote: post #91
forty wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also there is no app store on the web, no 30% fee. So no incentive for mobile platform owners to make it first class citizen.

The web isn’t a first class citizen on desktop as you can’t run new AAA games in one. The real difference is the web is a more limited UI that breaks down when your also forced to use the more limited interface of mobile. For example on desktop the top 10% or so of the screen is taken up by the browsers UI and tabs which is normally fine. On a tablet in keyboard mode your left with ~40% of the screen being useable. N…

[deleted]

Re: Why did the web take over desktop and not mobile?

#204

Post by eyelidlessness »

I think there’s a lot of good insight in the article, but it may be overthought. When I saw the question in the title, the answer that immediately came to mind was:

1. Switching apps on mobile is significantly less friction than switching browser tabs. (And it’s somewhat less friction for many people than switching apps on desktop.)

2. There’s significantly more investment in quality, mostly native, apps on mobile platforms.

Re: Why did the web take over desktop and not mobile?

#205

Post by iaml »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #161
beefield wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not have iphone either, but based on my observations many (most?) iphone owners have disabled safari location services from the os side, so you can't just allow them from the permission popup, but you need to go to the os settings and enable them for safari before you can bypass the permission popup. Again, I do not own an iphone, so not sure if it is exactly like this, but something like that needs to be done i…

I wish I could do that on macOS so I stop getting hit with pop ups in Safari asking me for my location. Homedepot.com is particularly annoying about this.

You can go to safari preferences>websites>location and set "when visiting other sites" to "deny". I don't get any popups that way.

Re: Why did the web take over desktop and not mobile?

#206

Post by streamofdigits »

the biological analogy is not really fitting. there is no natural ecosystem that is as concentrated a monoculture as the technology sector.

in nature, if your carefully nurtured monoculture (don't call me Microsoft) failed, your field would normally grow a dozen types of weeds, not another monoculture. the different tech epochs feel more like the passing of the "torch" from one dominant entity to the next rather than any broad based competition for survival of the fittest. this structure has as much to do with the political / regulatory systems of those eras as any intrinsic aspects of digital technology.

but on the substance of the future of the "web" (=the future of non-owned computing) its rough outlines are already there and they are beautiful: it will break the confines of the "browser" (the OS becomes the browser), and break the confines of the http protocol. mobile will be just another form factor in "convergent computing", offering another UI into both self-sovereign data spaces and federated interaction platforms

mark my words, the era now on its final legs will be remembered with disdain as a stagnant cash-cow period that had no moral scruples and exploited any and all human behavioral failings to turn users into exploitable idiots.

Re: Why did the web take over desktop and not mobile?

#207

Post by nemothekid »

throw_m239339 wrote: post #188
bhawks wrote: post #59

When iPhone and Android hit the scene the 'rich' web experience was primarily flash, silverlight, and some java applets (taking their last breathe). Input APIs for touch, multitouch and gesture were a mess for many years in the browser. Media queries didn't become a w3c recommendation until 2012 so building a ux that looked pleasant really wasn't possible. The memory, cpu, GPU, storage and battery constraints were un…

I would agree with you if not for the fact that a lot of these popular "native apps" are just webpages within a native wrapper, which kind of defeats your argument. Brands and vendors don't like the web because often they cannot 100% control what browsers do, and of course, a browser website cannot get access to the whole contact list, phone numbers and files on a phone device unlike a native app... Installing an app…

>I would agree with you if not for the fact that a lot of these popular "native apps" are just webpages within a native wrapper, which kind of defeats your argument.

This doesn't seem true at all. What popular "native" apps are you talking about? The most popular native apps couldn't exist on the web on the early days. YouTube couldn't work on the web due to the dependence on Flash. Instagram couldn't exist without camera access (and arguably fast image processing which JS couldn't do at the time). The technology to build some of the most downloaded apps like Words With Friends or Angry Birds could not be done on the web.

Re: Why did the web take over desktop and not mobile?

#208

Post by dTal »

d0mine wrote: post #189
AndrewUnmuted wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Go to any commuter train on a Monday morning and look what every last one of those people seated in the car are doing. They're consuming, not interacting. It is not lazy nor is it dismissive to suggest smartphones are largely devices that inspire consumption. It's just a proper observation.

If there billions of consumers and just 1 in 1000 creates something then we have millions of creators

That's neither relevant to the point under discussion (the primary function of the device), nor a valid defense of the smartphone (which should be judged on its intrinsic merits, not whether a tiny fraction of people manage to use it productively solely as a statistical consequence of Earth's vast population).

Re: Why did the web take over desktop and not mobile?

#209

Post by burnt_toast »

binkHN wrote: post #138
mattlondon wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The real question is how did the web remain relevant while being so far behind this tectonic platform shift? We didn't all shift to to smartphones the instant they became available. It took a while for people to transition to smartphones. Likewise getting an app up and running (in addition to their websites) took time for most businesses, and many probably waited before jumping on the band wagon I am sure everyone…

> Even now, I still think "I'll wait and do this on a proper computer". I'm routinely in the same boat, though it's less about the computer and more about not fighting with a tiny monitor. Most things built for mobile are "light" versions, as easily exposing all the bells and whistles on a 6" monitor would be a UI nightmare.

> Most things built for mobile are "light" versions.

The good sites are :)

The not so good ones "force" you to download an app with no alternative and require obtrusive permissions even though all you want to know is the answer to a quick question.

Re: Why did the web take over desktop and not mobile?

#210

Post by QuadrupleA »

Is it true that the web on mobile is dying or dead? I'm using HN here on mobile. At least half the visitors on most sites I build are on are on mobile. My most oft-used app is by far the browser.

And like others have said, often mobile apps are just thin containers around an embedded web app.

Facebook etc. apps are hugely popular, but the web is still very alive.

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