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Andrew Yang to launch a third party

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Re: Andrew Yang to launch a third party

#101

Post by throwaway34241 »

Barrin92 wrote: post #51
11thEarlOfMar wrote: post #17

I registered as a Democrat to vote for Andrew in the CA primary. I find his view of the state of the USA is much more current and much less clouded by the twisted incentives that drive so many career politicians. He has positions on just about every topic and explains the rationale behind them. It makes me wonder what the narrative against him would be. In the 2020 primaries and election, he wasn't taken seriously by…

>It makes me wonder what the narrative against him would be I think the question is what the narrative for him is. His views probably most closely resemble what the Niskanen-Center dubbed 'liberaltarian' a few years ago and that doesn't have much of a constituency. This sort of slightly wonkish, business man, tech bro hybrid will find some voters among the kind of young male demographic you find here or on reddit but…

Eh, I'll admit he probably does better than average among the tech crowd. But if polling is to be believed, he was one of the most electable (in a hypothetical general election) of the primary candidates last presidential election, so his messaging can't have been that off-putting. And I heard second-hand (from a young/right leaning Trump voter) that he was very popular among the young/right leaning 4chan crowd (which is a pretty far cry from the Niskanen Center).

I think a lot of his lack-of-success for his presidential run could be attributed to a perception that he was an inexperienced political lightweight, who didn't have a serious chance at winning. And he didn't really do all that badly considering where he started, he outlasted quite a few candidates who came in with much more experience and name recognition.

Re: Andrew Yang to launch a third party

#102

Post by bko »

robotresearcher wrote: post #61
11thEarlOfMar wrote: post #17

I registered as a Democrat to vote for Andrew in the CA primary. I find his view of the state of the USA is much more current and much less clouded by the twisted incentives that drive so many career politicians. He has positions on just about every topic and explains the rationale behind them. It makes me wonder what the narrative against him would be. In the 2020 primaries and election, he wasn't taken seriously by…

> He was quashed in the debates in lieu of ratings What does this mean? I know what the words mean, but can't catch your meaning.

There were a number of instances where national news broadcasters just left him out of polls or included his competitors with lower marks.

For instance CNN had a poll for and showed 6 candidates results, the lowest being for Beto O'Rourke, with a result of 1%. But Yang scored 3% in the poll but was just left out because for whatever reason he wasn't seen as a serious candidate.

https://nextshark.com/cnn-andrew-yang-graphic/

Re: Andrew Yang to launch a third party

#103

Post by throwaway34241 »

Barrin92 wrote: post #94
elzbardico wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Originally, no. Because originally UBI was designed to be used not as another social program, but in lieu of existing programs. When Friedman invented it, the idea was to get rid of things like public schools or whatever other public welfare program, fire all the public workers involved and instead give money to people so they would choose those services in the open market.

As far as I know that is still the case with Yang's UBI, which is why I brought it up in my original post. "The most important part of Mr. Yang’s 2020 guaranteed income plan was not the size of the checks but how he intended to pay for them. He promised to fund the program by implementing some new tax policies and “consolidating some welfare programs.” Anyone who wanted in would first have to make a choice: continue…

To clarify a bit, he didn't go nearly as far as Friedman did. As far as I am aware he was still in favor of public schools, dealing with health care separately, etc.

And he proposed people with benefits currently higher than the UBI level be able to stay on them (although presumably people on lower levels of benefits would switch to the higher-level UBI payments that don't come with any strings attached).

Re: Andrew Yang to launch a third party

#104

Post by kmos17 »

11thEarlOfMar wrote: post #17

I registered as a Democrat to vote for Andrew in the CA primary. I find his view of the state of the USA is much more current and much less clouded by the twisted incentives that drive so many career politicians. He has positions on just about every topic and explains the rationale behind them. It makes me wonder what the narrative against him would be. In the 2020 primaries and election, he wasn't taken seriously by…

He just didn’t come across as credible or serious during the NY mayoral primaries, and completely squandered an early lead. Just my take from listening in to his zoom, but he seemed light on issues, wasted too much time on gimmicks rather than someone ready to talk about serious problems and how to address them.

Re: Andrew Yang to launch a third party

#105

Post by N1H1L »

dsr_ wrote: post #64
tenderholdings wrote: post #57

A Gallup poll from August found that 29% of Americans identified as Democrats, 28% identified as Republican, and 40% as Independent. [ https://news.gallup.com/poll/15370/party-affiliation.aspx ] So, more people consider themselves independent than members of either party. If Andrew Yang can create the "Independent Party", perhaps they would get the most votes.

Americans love to consider themselves independent, but that doesn't mean they all have the same political beliefs or even that they are moderate; for the most part, "independent" means that they will vote mostly for one party but like to occasionally vote for individual candidates that they personally like, regardless of party.

Independent mostly means politically unengaged

Re: Andrew Yang to launch a third party

#106

Post by allemagne »

Andrew Yang was smart and self-aware enough of his own political goals and the electoral reality of RCV to endorse Kathryn Garcia near the end of the NYC mayoral primary. I respected that.

In FPTP the spoiler effect is not just a bogeyman that the two dominant parties trot out to scare you into voting for them, it's a well-understood mathematical inevitability. Perot led to Clinton. Nader led to Bush II.

Any third party in America that reaches the brink of national prominence will be (and has been) counterproductive to its own professed aims. I think what is most relevant to Yang is that this is extremely understood in the hyperpartisan modern environment. See the conservative glee and support for Kanye West's 2020 campaign, and the liberal celebration at rumors that Donald Trump was starting a new political party.

Being extremely selective about where to run candidates and focusing on a handful of "non-partisan" issues (good luck) would help a lot. However, Yang's first hurdle will be be swimming upstream against potential allies who will not want to give "the other side" a win. I honestly don't think anyone can win that fight right now.

Re: Andrew Yang to launch a third party

#107

Post by gatlin »

11thEarlOfMar wrote: post #17

I registered as a Democrat to vote for Andrew in the CA primary. I find his view of the state of the USA is much more current and much less clouded by the twisted incentives that drive so many career politicians. He has positions on just about every topic and explains the rationale behind them. It makes me wonder what the narrative against him would be. In the 2020 primaries and election, he wasn't taken seriously by…

The narrative against him is his refusal to adopt better policies. He wants to be seen as supporting M4A but when it's all done and dusted, he doesn't. That alone will prevent me from giving him a second look. We must look to redistributive policies. If an M4A proposal has flaws, for instance, the discussion needs to be focused 100% on closing those specific gaps. Because the problem is poor distribution of wealth and resources and no sign this will change without intervention.

In my opinion a candidate must at bare minimum correctly identify issues and not be afraid to name the unbridled solutions.

Re: Andrew Yang to launch a third party

#108

Post by [deleted] »

bko wrote: post #102
robotresearcher wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> He was quashed in the debates in lieu of ratings What does this mean? I know what the words mean, but can't catch your meaning.

There were a number of instances where national news broadcasters just left him out of polls or included his competitors with lower marks. For instance CNN had a poll for and showed 6 candidates results, the lowest being for Beto O'Rourke, with a result of 1%. But Yang scored 3% in the poll but was just left out because for whatever reason he wasn't seen as a serious candidate. https://nextshark.com/cnn-andrew-yang-g…

[deleted]

Re: Andrew Yang to launch a third party

#109

Post by silisili »

UncleOxidant wrote: post #26
11thEarlOfMar wrote: post #17

I registered as a Democrat to vote for Andrew in the CA primary. I find his view of the state of the USA is much more current and much less clouded by the twisted incentives that drive so many career politicians. He has positions on just about every topic and explains the rationale behind them. It makes me wonder what the narrative against him would be. In the 2020 primaries and election, he wasn't taken seriously by…

> I suppose the question ultimately will be whether his party pull more votes from Democrats or Republicans I think it's pretty clear that he'd pull more Dems than Reps. That would be a very bad thing in 2024, so you'll probably see a lot of encouragement from Republicans and an lot of discouragement from Democrats.

This is such a discouraging and sad view point. I'm not saying it's wrong, just pessimistic, and not blaming you for saying it just venting. Who cares if it's more x than y. Most voters are moderates. Myself, and many moderates, feel completely unrepresented by either side. Not liberal enough to vote D, and not conservative enough to vote R. You'd think they'd be drifting together, but increasingly are drifting further apart. Why not encourage more parties, or at least some middle ground party, if what we have today sucks. Surely there's a better reason than "so the other guys don't win"

Re: Andrew Yang to launch a third party

#110

Post by ngokevin »

perardi wrote: post #58
ngokevin wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's ironic to be mocking this Hacker News, where people every day are launching upstart ideas to take on massive incumbents. Launching your own basketball league isn't even that ridiculous! I could see a basketball league with influencers that's more about the entertainment and characters versus skill level having a chance.

They sure kept trying that for football. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XFL_(2001) And it sure went nowhere.

I feel AEW is becoming a contender WWE (owner of XFL) in just a couple years, although it did take like hundreds of millions of dollars.
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