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The web is swallowing the desktop whole (2017)

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Re: The web is swallowing the desktop whole (2017)

#31

Post by MattGaiser »

vbezhenar wrote: post #24
hresvelgr wrote: post #6

Web still has by far the best developer experience + cross platform stability, not to mention the lowest barrier to entry. I would be really interested to see what happens with Tauri[1] as that looks like a more promising alternative to Electron. I do want to see a return to native apps but there are no worthwhile incentives to do so outside of "our customers demanded a native app." [1] https://tauri.studio/en/

> our customers demanded a native app Isn't customer demands are the main incentive for any developer?

It is not enough that customers demand. Customers also need to be willing to quit the product over it.

Re: The web is swallowing the desktop whole (2017)

#32

Post by jeswin »

xvector wrote: post #21
hresvelgr wrote: post #6

Web still has by far the best developer experience + cross platform stability, not to mention the lowest barrier to entry. I would be really interested to see what happens with Tauri[1] as that looks like a more promising alternative to Electron. I do want to see a return to native apps but there are no worthwhile incentives to do so outside of "our customers demanded a native app." [1] https://tauri.studio/en/

> I do want to see a return to native apps but there are no worthwhile incentives to do so outside of "our customers demanded a native app." Every native app I have ever used has been many times snappier than its Electron/Web equivalent. Think on why customers demand native apps.

How can you say that customers are demanding native apps when only a minuscule number of users can tell if an app is native or not? Most are not even familiar with the term native; desktop installed app (of all types) vs browser app at best.

Re: The web is swallowing the desktop whole (2017)

#33

Post by jeswin »

smackeyacky wrote: post #20
hresvelgr wrote: post #6

Web still has by far the best developer experience + cross platform stability, not to mention the lowest barrier to entry. I would be really interested to see what happens with Tauri[1] as that looks like a more promising alternative to Electron. I do want to see a return to native apps but there are no worthwhile incentives to do so outside of "our customers demanded a native app." [1] https://tauri.studio/en/

It doesn't help that for the major consumer platform (Windows), Microsoft can't make their mind up about how to replace Win32 or WinForms. It seems like every other week there is some new framework announced, so even if you have a need to make a native app, choosing how to do it has become near impossible. Is it .NET Maui? Should I try Electronize? or take a huge punt on Avalonia? It's easier just to wrap up a web ap…

That train left long back; nobody wants a Windows-only app when half the management are using Macs.

Unless of course you're taking about pro apps like AutoCad or Photoshop; but they have never been electron and unlikely to ever be.

Re: The web is swallowing the desktop whole (2017)

#34

Post by ehnto »

smackeyacky wrote: post #20
hresvelgr wrote: post #6

Web still has by far the best developer experience + cross platform stability, not to mention the lowest barrier to entry. I would be really interested to see what happens with Tauri[1] as that looks like a more promising alternative to Electron. I do want to see a return to native apps but there are no worthwhile incentives to do so outside of "our customers demanded a native app." [1] https://tauri.studio/en/

It doesn't help that for the major consumer platform (Windows), Microsoft can't make their mind up about how to replace Win32 or WinForms. It seems like every other week there is some new framework announced, so even if you have a need to make a native app, choosing how to do it has become near impossible. Is it .NET Maui? Should I try Electronize? or take a huge punt on Avalonia? It's easier just to wrap up a web ap…

I have seen this indecision as a death knell on a few projects. You really just have to pick something, especially if you stop developing the soon to be deprecated tooling.

If it takes you two years to pick a new method, then all your developer community has to sit on their laurels. They can't invest in the old platform, they can't invest in novel tooling of their own, and they can't build with the new thing because you haven't chosen it yet.

Re: The web is swallowing the desktop whole (2017)

#35

Post by MattGaiser »

smackeyacky wrote: post #20
hresvelgr wrote: post #6

Web still has by far the best developer experience + cross platform stability, not to mention the lowest barrier to entry. I would be really interested to see what happens with Tauri[1] as that looks like a more promising alternative to Electron. I do want to see a return to native apps but there are no worthwhile incentives to do so outside of "our customers demanded a native app." [1] https://tauri.studio/en/

It doesn't help that for the major consumer platform (Windows), Microsoft can't make their mind up about how to replace Win32 or WinForms. It seems like every other week there is some new framework announced, so even if you have a need to make a native app, choosing how to do it has become near impossible. Is it .NET Maui? Should I try Electronize? or take a huge punt on Avalonia? It's easier just to wrap up a web ap…

For some platforms the official way to do things now is to make it a web app. Consider Microsoft Word Add Ins. The official way to do them now is with JS, React or Angular.

Re: The web is swallowing the desktop whole (2017)

#36

Post by [deleted] »

hyperhopper wrote: post #3

... "And nobody noticed"??? Gsuite, office365, etc, offer this as a _feature_. People have noticed. Even as far as election goes, tons of people complain about the higher ram usage, bloat, etc. Sure, non technical users may not know why, but technical users do, and almost everybody notices a difference in some form or another.

[deleted]

Re: The web is swallowing the desktop whole (2017)

#37

Post by CodeArtisan »

mohanmcgeek wrote: post #2

Electron apps are still desktop apps. The web however did eat the desktop: everything other the browser and the text editor is now a web app. I have literally 4 apps that I use on my machine: terminal and postman in addition to the above. I am wondering why mobile apps too haven't entirely been replaced by Web apps

An electron app is not necessary SaaS but it is still a hidden web browser running an application built on web technologies (Essentially HTML5 which is html+css+javascript).

Re: The web is swallowing the desktop whole (2017)

#38

Post by tephra »

PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #23
mohanmcgeek wrote: post #2

Electron apps are still desktop apps. The web however did eat the desktop: everything other the browser and the text editor is now a web app. I have literally 4 apps that I use on my machine: terminal and postman in addition to the above. I am wondering why mobile apps too haven't entirely been replaced by Web apps

> everything other the browser and the text editor is now a web app video editing, DAWs, music notation, CAD/CAM, 3D modelling (think Blender), compilers, linkers, IDE's other than VSCode, local photo management, media players, messaging services (telegram etc), device management ... these and many more called and laughed at your claim.

IIRC you can use fusion 360 in the browser now?

WhatsApp is of course available on the web. I'm a regular user of play.spotify.com, works great. Figma is a great design tool available only on the web.

I do get your point, but there are more and more things moving to the web as more and more standards are being published (if you think this is a good idea is another discussion).

Modern html and CSS is by far the least complex GUI framework I've used. And it is (somewhat) cross platform.

Re: The web is swallowing the desktop whole (2017)

#39

Post by vmladenov »

speedgoose wrote: post #19
mohanmcgeek wrote: post #2

Electron apps are still desktop apps. The web however did eat the desktop: everything other the browser and the text editor is now a web app. I have literally 4 apps that I use on my machine: terminal and postman in addition to the above. I am wondering why mobile apps too haven't entirely been replaced by Web apps

You don't have a lot web apps on mobile because the mobile web browsers provide a worse experience compared to native applications, unlike Electron or Chrome on Desktop that provides a much better experience in general (unless you have a 10 years old hardware with very little ram or are into old school GUI I know). The companies making web browsers and mobile operating systems are the same companies making native app…

Electron’s user experience is atrocious even on recent hardware. It falls right into the uncanny valley of superficially appearing native and while not behaving natively.
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