20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports? • Hacker News Board

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#521

Post by rootusrootus » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 4:18 PM UTC

timr wrote: post #439

rootusrootus wrote: post #431

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does that even happen? I have pre-check, and it's always been an entirely separate line. They'd have to do a fair amount of work to redirect you over to the 'regular' line.

It used to happen only at smaller airports that didn't have the capacity to handle extra lines. But lately, I've had it happen at bit airports (like ATL), so I'm not really sure. The answer to your (implicit?) question is that it doesn't work. The staff take the card from you at the start of the process, and once your bag is in the machine, they have no idea if it's yours. So far, every time this has happened, I"ve b…

So after you already start the x-ray process, they take you aside and make you do the shoes, belt, and the rest?

If I sound confused, it's because I am :). I don't get a pre-check card, it just shows up as a notation on my boarding pass. I scan it just like normal, then shove my phone into my backpack and toss it on the belt. No removing my shoes, belt, etc.

They also won't touch my bag, and I have to be the one to push it onto the feed belt of the scanner. They have to have a pretty good idea that it belongs to me.

Coincidentally, I just travelled through ATL a few weeks ago. It's never as smooth as my home airport (PDX) because it's a much busier airport, but I don't recall anything out of the ordinary happening.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#522

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 4:20 PM UTC

Dudeman112 wrote: post #472

platz wrote: post #332

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not if the definition of terrorism I use is one of the 11 definitions that preclude that possibility.

Yes, some definitions are crappy. Do we have a word for "imperialist government uses violence against people to achieve political goals"? Because "it's not terrorism because it's a state" is always gonna stink of trying to dodge the topic on a technicality.

[deleted]

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#523

Post by duxup » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 4:21 PM UTC

biomcgary wrote: post #504

duxup wrote: post #448

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably because we can't see much evidence of airport security doing anything. And vaccines and etc are backed by science?

Know of any randomized controlled trials on airport security?

It would be nice if they would do that.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#524

Post by lexapro » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 4:21 PM UTC

fouc wrote: post #233

NikolaNovak wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"My biggest challenge over the years was remembering what to do in each place as the security people at the airports had a tendency to get upset if you didn't do it their preferred way." It can differ from airport to airport. I traveled from Ottawa to Toronto often enough for it to be mindless but differences between two national airports in same province of same country on same airline still caught me if I went too…

I'd stick with the more conservative measure, taking the tablet out all the time, even if it might not have been required. Also I wouldn't bother verbally responding if they ask me to do something, I'd just do it and keep my lips sealed.

A simple "okay" followed by compliance also works.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#525

Post by recursive » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 4:21 PM UTC

hunterb123 wrote: post #508

jjeaff wrote: post #479

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are the reasons not to get a vaccine? I haven't seen any real data that indicated that.

Waiting to see the long term effects of a mRNA vaccine? Natural immunity as I mentioned before. Religious reasons. Just because. You don't need a reason, it's your body.

I don't understand "natural immunity" as a reason. I think I don't know what it actually means.

As far as I know, natural immunity is conferred if and only if you've recovered from the virus. And one of the goals of the vaccine is to avoid getting it in the first place. But to get natural immunity, you have to be infected first. It seems a bit like burning down your house to prevent arson from a stranger. Have I misunderstood "natural immunity"?

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#526

Post by KKKKkkkk1 » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 4:22 PM UTC

platz wrote: post #332

maybelsyrup wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> non-state actors States can, have, and do engage in terrorism.

Not if the definition of terrorism I use is one of the 11 definitions that preclude that possibility.

What is the appropriate word to use for Iran blowing up a Jewish cultural center in Argentina? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMIA_bombing

Note that the word "terror" appears 34 times in that Wikipedia article.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#527

Post by kjkjadksj » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 4:23 PM UTC

GDC7 wrote: post #60

And of course everybody ignores trains, they don't even look at you...like the 300 souls aboard a train don't matter. Also the 10000+ souls at the departing and arrival train station also don't matter. Not to mention the 4000 souls aboard cruise ships. It ain't about safety from ill-intentioned people...it's about protecting the POTUS from having to give the order to open fire on an hijacked civilian plane. That's th…

The most they will do with a train is hit it against another and i bet the speed is capped anyhow to make turns within the system. Much more effective to load a van with bombs and leave it someplace. A plane is a cruise missile in comparison and can destroy anything you point it at.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#528

Post by JohnFen » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 4:24 PM UTC

hunterb123 wrote: post #508

jjeaff wrote: post #479

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are the reasons not to get a vaccine? I haven't seen any real data that indicated that.

Waiting to see the long term effects of a mRNA vaccine? Natural immunity as I mentioned before. Religious reasons. Just because. You don't need a reason, it's your body.

> You don't need a reason, it's your body.

The reason is to help protect and care for your fellow human beings.

"It's your body" only counts if what you're doing with it isn't putting unconsenting others at risk. Forgoing the vaccine without a solid medical reason is putting others at risk.

By your logic, you should be able to punch anyone in the face at any time, because your fist is part of your body, and "it's your body".

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#529

Post by lexapro » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 4:24 PM UTC

curryst wrote: post #392

dsauerbrun wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought the shoes being taken off wasn't arbitrary. I thought it was because of the shoe bomber(Richard Reed)

It's arbitrary because all they do is X-ray them. X-rays can't tell you whether there are explosives in the shoe, all you can do is look for signs the shoe has been altered. I don't think that requirement would have stopped Richard Reid. Maybe someone notices that his shoes look a little odd under the X-ray, but with sports shoes coming with weird air pockets and Heelys existing, it's not that odd. It also slows down…

>We'd be better off just forcing everyone to do the hand swabs.

That or detection dogs.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#530

Post by hunterb123 » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 4:25 PM UTC

recursive wrote: post #525

hunterb123 wrote: post #508

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Waiting to see the long term effects of a mRNA vaccine? Natural immunity as I mentioned before. Religious reasons. Just because. You don't need a reason, it's your body.

I don't understand "natural immunity" as a reason. I think I don't know what it actually means. As far as I know, natural immunity is conferred if and only if you've recovered from the virus. And one of the goals of the vaccine is to avoid getting it in the first place. But to get natural immunity, you have to be infected first. It seems a bit like burning down your house to prevent arson from a stranger. Have I misu…

Likewise, yelling at people to get the vaccine makes no sense.

If you don't want to catch the virus, get the vaccine. Don't worry about others.

They will get the virus and then get natural immunity. People will have adverse reactions to both covid and the vaccine. Let them weigh the risk to which one.