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20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

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Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#481

Post by rswail »

bakuninsbart wrote: post #405
lexapro wrote: post #339

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the case of 9/11 the most likely motive was retaliation. If you could ask the terrorists, they would tell you that America terrorized them first (I'm not saying that's accurate).

There's nothing hypothetical about it. I'm actually baffled at the fact that people here infer random motivations when Usama bin Laden gave interviews as far back as the early 90s and held multiple speeches after 9/11. The stated goal of the attacks was to show Americans that their continuous war and support for secular dictators in the Muslim world would come with high cost, and to force the American government to r…

I'd say it's been remarkably successful.

The US has abandoned Syria, Iraq, Kurds. It still has some sway with Saudi Arabia and Israel, none in Egypt or Libya.

The withdrawal from Afghanistan is a culmination of that.

The neo-conservative response to Al Qaeda was exactly what was needed to provoke this collapse over 20 years.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#482

Post by horsawlarway »

ctrlp wrote: post #383
horsawlarway wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The unstated (and unacknowledged function) that has perpetuated the practice despite every traveler hating it (and its obvious futility), is to intimidate travelers and provide a convenient mechanism of crowd-control. I think you're misguided here. I certainly do understand the viewpoint that this security theater is harmful (and agree, actually). But lets be honest: The TSA has nothing to do with "Scaring the shee…

What percentage of TSA employees are former military?

I looked and I can't actually find a good answer to that.

I do know that the job requirements are basically:

1. US citizen

2. High school diploma

3. 18+ years old

4. Pass drug/background screening

For the pay, the job requirements are very low. They also follow the "Veterans preference" practice during hiring. This is actually pretty typical across many government jobs (See https://www.usajobs.gov/).

My experience with trying to apply to these jobs (admittedly second hand, watching my wife apply to meet grant-related conditions) is that if you're an honorably discharged veteran, your resume goes into bucket #1, and if they can fill the position from that bucket, they won't even look at bucket #2, which is public applications.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#483

Post by duxup »

lexapro wrote: post #346
wpietri wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the primary goal of security at a college football game to stop a suicide bomber? I strongly doubt that's how they see it.

Yeah, isn't it to prevent hooligans from bringing weapons into the stadium?

That's not really a problem for college football, or really any sport in the US. For whatever reason the hooligan thing isn't a system in the US.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#484

Post by mrtksn »

hunterb123 wrote: post #461
mrtksn wrote: post #454

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I got vaccinated to protect myself, not fan of natural immunity through suffocating. 2 days pain in the shoulder, 1 day of a mild fever and affectionate feelings towards Bill Gates is a great bargain.

Funny reddit quip you got there, but I'm talking about those who already have immunity, why should they risk the vaccine, even if small. https://openvaers.com/covid-data

I wouldn't know why those who already have immunity would get the vaccine. There are studies showing that a shot post Covid-19 greatly increases the immune response agains variants, so there could be reasons.

In Europe getting the decease and beating it is considered good enough for immunity. Talk to your local authorities if you are not happy with your local practices.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#485

Post by jaywalk »

spamizbad wrote: post #254
spoonjim wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That security isn’t necessarily to stop terrorism. It’s also to stop people from bringing in weapons and then using them in drunken brawls.

Most airline passengers would trade dry flights for pre-9/11 security screenings.

Most airline passengers can already trade $85 every five years for pre-9/11 security screenings. They simply choose not to.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#486

Post by rswail »

gruez wrote: post #340
mLuby wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To quibble: terrorism is using dramatic violence to achieve political ends. It just so happens that the victimized society often wants to increase security. The US had at least 3 major responses to 9/11: 1) seek revenge (invade Afghanistan, kill Bin Laden), 2) armor up (Dept. of Homeland Security), and 3) unify under nationalism (flags everywhere). It's pretty easy to imagine a timeline where some or none of those ha…

> 3) unify under nationalism (flags everywhere) People flying flags everywhere weren't a thing in the 80s or 90s?

Not as much and not as rabid. Combination of the Gringrich bullshit "culture issues" of the 90s and the initially patriotic and then nationalistic response to 9/11.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#487

Post by lolsal »

rootusrootus wrote: post #437
fma wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This would really only apply for fights where I'm checking in luggage...international flights, for example. I wouldn't mind a feature where I can drop off my luggage somewhere near my house the day before my flight and it gets tagged, bulked transferred and inspected at the airport. This would allow me to straight to the gate and not need to check in large luggage or fumble with luggage while rushing for a flight. Th…

I'm half-surprised we don't already have this. The airlines already use some sort of uber-like self-employed contractors to deliver lost luggage. They could offer the same service in the other direction.

I believe this is pretty common in Japan. I did something like this with my luggage when using the trains from city to city.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#488

Post by yunohn »

woofie11 wrote: post #191
sidlls wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have never heard of any life-threatening allergic reaction to any drug or bomb sniffing dog. Has that actually happened? If so...how, when, and where?

Asthma attacks are not uncommon in response to dog dander. Those can be life-threatening, but can be managed with albuterol. 30 seconds with Google will turn up countless documented instances. Anaphylaxis is a very rare response to animal dander, but there have been a few documented instances: https://www.petful.com/misc/can-pet-allergies-kill-me/ What's amazing is the number of dog owners who don't believe in dog al…

> dogs are hypoallergenic due to fur/hair (dander is in the saliva)

I’ve read the same explanation for cats. But, I find it hard to believe. Pets are constantly licking their fur, and shedding said fur all over the place. It’s very clear to me that more fur = higher chances of allergic reactions.

What am I missing?

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#489

Post by hunterb123 »

duxup wrote: post #434
hunterb123 wrote: post #420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

>Thinking that you need everyone to get a vaccine to live a normal life is a strange bar. I don't understand what that means. What happened to thinking of other people? When I think of getting a vaccine... I just do it as a part of normal life. It doesn't change my life at all, outside of added immunity.

> When I think of getting a vaccine... I just do it as a part of normal life

That's exactly my point. You aren't thinking, you're just following.

> What happened to thinking of other people?

My point as well. It's the same "think of the children" argument that was being discussed above.

That itself is not a reason. People have immunity. The curve is flattened, the goal posts have been moved out of the stadium.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#490

Post by cycomanic »

throwaway0a5e wrote: post #393
baybal2 wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Saudi Arabia's decades long record of cultivating extremist outfits, and "influence operations" is, thought, not a conspiracy theory, but a fact. When I first seen 9/11 on TV as an 11 year old, I instantly thought that Ryadh will be turned into a crater within a few hours. I dropped my jaw out of suprise, when I heard US going to declare war on Iraq — Saudis' biggest enemy. It made zero sense. I kept on watching the…

>I dropped my jaw out of suprise, when I heard US going to declare war on Iraq — Saudis' biggest enemy. You're being more than a little disingenuous ignoring the fact that we invaded Afghanistan specifically to go after the extremist group that was responsible for 9/11 about 2yr prior to invading Iraq, which was done for different reasons and "harboring terrorists" took a back seat to WMDs on that list of reasons.

That doesn't change his main point. Saudi Arabia was one of the primary financiers of the taliban and Al Qaida, but instead of going after the Saudis some of the only non military flights to be allowed to fly just after 9/11 were private jets that flew Saudi Royal family members out of the country.
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