Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Australia’s new mass surveillance mandate

digitalrightswatch.org.au

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

761–770 of 894 posts

Re: Australia’s new mass surveillance mandate

#761

Post by wutbrodo »

prohobo wrote: post #303
roody15 wrote: post #269

I simply cannot wrap my mind around what is happening in Australia. Continuing a lockwdown while the number of positive covid cases remains in the low hundreds and the daily death rate in the lower tens to single digits. Nothing makes sense here. Draconian laws, complete shutdown over something that is and has been statistically under control and managed from months. Am I alone here or do people really think what is…

Right, there's something disconcerting about the way people are behaving in this situation, and it's hard to process this as something that could reasonably happen. "I thought we were rational people in a free society?" The terrible thing is that this is exactly how people behaved in "historical" times - a foreshadowing to what lies ahead. The vast majority of people believe we are post-history, and that we're someho…

> . "I thought we were rational people in a free society

There is no polity in the world in which "rational people" drove covid policy (or individual behavior) to any significant degree. Whether we're talking about Florida's low restrictions and high cases or the Bay Area's converse outcome, the best you can hope for is that the masses, through their blind superstition and social signaling, ended up somewhere close to the policy/behavior landscape that you think is optimal.

Re: Australia’s new mass surveillance mandate

#763

Post by raxxorrax »

prohobo wrote: post #303
roody15 wrote: post #269

I simply cannot wrap my mind around what is happening in Australia. Continuing a lockwdown while the number of positive covid cases remains in the low hundreds and the daily death rate in the lower tens to single digits. Nothing makes sense here. Draconian laws, complete shutdown over something that is and has been statistically under control and managed from months. Am I alone here or do people really think what is…

Right, there's something disconcerting about the way people are behaving in this situation, and it's hard to process this as something that could reasonably happen. "I thought we were rational people in a free society?" The terrible thing is that this is exactly how people behaved in "historical" times - a foreshadowing to what lies ahead. The vast majority of people believe we are post-history, and that we're someho…

The difference between modern and medieval people isn't physiological, it is just education. But since stupidity is unlimited, it will just pick up a new mantle and look a bit different.

Rules of public relation will make it increasingly difficult for any official to take a more relaxed stand. Fearful people are motivated people and will make themselves heard, no matter if their fears are justified or not.

Re: Australia’s new mass surveillance mandate

#764

Post by mykmallett »

roody15 wrote: post #369
0xdeadb00f wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This talk about "Draconian" lockdown in Australia needs to stop. Our privacy and digital rights laws are awful. But the lockdowns are necessary. NSW had upward of 1000+ cases and that's why they're (still) in a strict lockdown. QLD and i beleive WA as well for example are not in lockdown at all because of their much much lower daily cases. Also, "50 cases in a nation of millions"? I dont know where you're getting you…

1200+ cases in NSW out of a population of over 8 million. So we should extend a strict lockdown … to do what exactly? Is the plan to manage this virus with a series of alternating lockdowns and get the number of cases to zero? Is this realistic, is this the type of world you want to live in? The virus appears to be as contagious as chicken pox, vaccines help with serious cases but are doing little unfortunately to st…

per day*

Re: Australia’s new mass surveillance mandate

#765

Post by mykmallett »

switch007 wrote: post #513
quickthrower2 wrote: post #495

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To answer the last question they plan to open up once double vaccination rates hit a target I think 80%. I think this makes sense.

The target will move once it hits 80%. This is so obvious I feel sorry for all of you/them

The target is moving indeed, it's going down. NSW didn't want to lock down at all, but had to.

Re: Australia’s new mass surveillance mandate

#766

Post by _kbh_ »

nickysielicki wrote: post #79

These "data disruption warrants" are the most interesting to me: > Data disruption means adding, copying, deleting or altering data held in a computer. This can only be done in order to frustrate the commission of offences or determine relevance of data. To assist disruption, a warrant can also authorise other facilitative activities, such as entering specified premises, using electronic equipment to obtain access to…

Scary shit. Sounds like they're pretty drunk with power. Does Australia really have a capable offensive security group like the NSA to pull these sorts of things off, though?

They do but the real question is whether its appropriate to source intelligence from a place like the NSA when the outcomes are meant to be used by the police.

Re: Australia’s new mass surveillance mandate

#767

Post by diatone »

sbr464 wrote: post #239
cottsak wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an important point. How do we vote for and elect representatives in sufficient quantities that will throw out privacy and security overreaches like this? Very few of the representatives in both houses will understand the technical means, underpinnings, and exploit and overreach potential of these bills because they simply don't understand the technology in the middle. All a party/member needs to do is draft t…

I think one solution could be to vote in a faceless/anonymous type candidate that simply provides the context/details up for any vote, then votes based on the outcome of a live poll from their constituents. There would be several tech challenges, but it could provide a more pure form of the people’s will.

You may want to check out the Flux party, they've been around for a number of years now: https://voteflux.org/about/faq/

Re: Australia’s new mass surveillance mandate

#768

Post by kongin »

Clubber wrote: post #702
oblio wrote: post #679

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you even read your own links? > As part of a sweeping repeal of wartime laws, Congress repealed the Sedition Act on December 13, 1920 The second wasn't a wartime act and even that was repealed. Talk about cherry picking.

He meant the Espionage Act, which is currently being used to seek prosecution of Snowden and Assange, among others. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Espionage_Act_of_1917

Yes, it's hard to keep track of which act was used to curtail what freedoms.

The Sedition Act was used to silence opposition to conscription and gave us the immortal quote of "The most stringent protection of free speech would not protect a man in falsely shouting fire in a theatre and causing a panic."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schenck_v._United_States

Of course the 'fire' in that case was this letter: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schenck_v._United_States#/medi...

Which seems like an extremely level headed question about conscription in the US given that involuntary servitude should only be a punishment for a crime.

Re: Australia’s new mass surveillance mandate

#769

Post by [deleted] »

Nursie wrote: post #573
sandworm101 wrote: post #547

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> rather than stay at a quarantine facility. Nobody is being forced to use the app. Download the app or we send you to a camp? That isn't much of a choice. I'd say it is about as non-choice as possible while still meeting the literal definition.

I'll say what I said on the other thread - If you want to present an argument against quarantine being needed or warranted, please go ahead. Checking in on the app is the least intrusive of the three options - quarantine under guard (usually in a hotel, like the one I'm in right now), quarantine at home with police visits tio ensure compliance, or quarantine at home checking in to the app once or twice a day. In this…

[deleted]

Re: Australia’s new mass surveillance mandate

#770

Post by cormacrelf »

AussieWog93 wrote: post #595
0xdeadb00f wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This talk about "Draconian" lockdown in Australia needs to stop. Our privacy and digital rights laws are awful. But the lockdowns are necessary. NSW had upward of 1000+ cases and that's why they're (still) in a strict lockdown. QLD and i beleive WA as well for example are not in lockdown at all because of their much much lower daily cases. Also, "50 cases in a nation of millions"? I dont know where you're getting you…

>This talk about "Draconian" lockdown in Australia needs to stop. I haven't been following the lockdown laws interstate, but here in Victoria there have definitely been some restrictions that seemed to be extremely harsh and soul-crushing in comparison to their effectiveness at stopping the virus. The 5km radius and curfew both spring to mind. I (legally) haven't been able to see a single friend or family member for…

Hope you’re ok mate. We’ll be vaccinated soon, hold the fort. I can’t see my family and friends either and it’s undeniably tough. But the rules do make sense, it’s just always hard to see that when they affect you.

The 5km makes it possible for them to be talking about the western suburbs being somewhat under control, and for targeted testing and messaging operations to be useful. My area has been in a lull for a bit after being in the spotlight, so I’ve checked out of keeping track —- that is a luxury in its own way. Without the 5km I don’t think I would have that reprieve from the stress.

Post reply on HN