Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know (2018)

slatestarcodex.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 156 posts

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know (2018)

#71

Post by 55555 »

emodendroket wrote: post #27
lamontcg wrote: post #4

> the correct dose A single correct dose is a myth. The author even sort of notes that with the differences between teenagers, 25 year olds and the elderly. There's also a wide variety of sleep disorders which are touched on in the article. I've suffered with 2.5mg before for long enough to understand that it doesn't work for me, no matter how many studies you have with 95% CL that the dose is much lower. The 5mg tab…

I'm not sure you can trust the numbers on unregulated supplements anyway.

You can't.

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know (2018)

#72

Post by thaw13579 »

TylerLives wrote: post #3

> I think you could make an argument for anything up to 1 mg. Anything beyond that and you’re definitely too high So, should I take the whole 1 mg pill or divide it into smaller doses?

I use melatonin gummies, which are easily divided to get a sufficiently small does without much work, highly recommended

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know (2018)

#73

Post by xallarap »

theptip wrote: post #51
cleansingfire wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, some people need more than the commercial supplements provide. That's the point. The effective range varies by an order of magnitude. The author denies the actual variety of human needs.

3mg is not the correct starting dose. If you need to adjust up, fine, but for most people that won’t be required. Starting too high and adjusting down is not the correct approach (a general rule, not just for this drug).

started with 30 mg, adjusted up to 90. Became a bit Cold and unmotivated.. slept normally.

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know (2018)

#74

Post by trainsplanes »

smnplk wrote: post #65
lamontcg wrote: post #4

> the correct dose A single correct dose is a myth. The author even sort of notes that with the differences between teenagers, 25 year olds and the elderly. There's also a wide variety of sleep disorders which are touched on in the article. I've suffered with 2.5mg before for long enough to understand that it doesn't work for me, no matter how many studies you have with 95% CL that the dose is much lower. The 5mg tab…

How did you cure your DSPD? I am asking for a friend..:P

As someone who was stuck on a 26 hour schedule for years, I just... grew out of it.

One day around age 26 it just went away after having been a problem since early high school. No clue why. If you're still young, your "problem" may simply be youth.

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know (2018)

#75

Post by polskibus »

yosito wrote: post #53
lamontcg wrote: post #4

> the correct dose A single correct dose is a myth. The author even sort of notes that with the differences between teenagers, 25 year olds and the elderly. There's also a wide variety of sleep disorders which are touched on in the article. I've suffered with 2.5mg before for long enough to understand that it doesn't work for me, no matter how many studies you have with 95% CL that the dose is much lower. The 5mg tab…

Melatonin is not like a sleeping pill where more will necessarily make you more drowsy. It is a hormone that signals to your body that it is time to sleep. I can't find it right now, but there was a study of different doses in a large number of people that determined that just 0.2mg was more effective than larger doses for most people. And I've found that's true for me too. When I use melatonin, I use 0.2mg, and I fa…

I always wonder if some of the self reported dosage variability for pills comes from differences in absorbtion of pills. Maybe some ppl's stomach acids or bacterial flora destroy particular molecules more or prevents absorption more than in other ppl?

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know (2018)

#76

Post by jspash »

xtracto wrote: post #13
adventured wrote: post #8

I started to gradually notice some tossing and turning throughout the night in my mid 30s. I began taking one 100mg capsule of magnesium citrate right before I attempt to go to sleep. Has worked exceptionally well for about seven years now. Knocks me out, with no negative reaction to the magnesium (some people apparently have a negative stomach and or bowel reaction to magnesium supplements; I haven't attempted high…

My wife suffered from sleeping issues for a very long time. She tried everything under the sun including nytol, sublingual melatonin , slow release melatonin, passiflora and other teas. Nothing really helped her until eventually someone suggested ZMA (a zinc magnesium complex used by bodybuilders ) . That was a saving pill for her and fixed her sleep.

My experience also. Melatonin did absolutely nothing.

ZMA makes me drowsy within minutes. I can fight that off but will eventually succumb. The only side-effect I've noticed other than the incredibly vidid and sometimes nightmarish dreams is that the effect will linger long into the next day.

Mind you, the sleep is incredibly deep and restorative. It's not like some other sleeping pills that just knock you out, but you never reach REM sleep, waking up feeling tired.

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know (2018)

#77

Post by hoten »

playcache wrote: post #46

I wonder how many folks that are taking Melatonin are coffee drinkers? I spent years trying to crack my sleep issues. Blackout curtains, magnesium malate / citrate, no electronic devices for an hour before bed, CBD oil, even stronger CBD oil, different doses of Melatonin, 5-HTP, valerian extract, sleep apnea tests. It never really significantly occured to me that it would be coffee as I believed I had ruled this out.…

Once I learned the half-life of caffeine is 5-9 hours, I started a rule where I only had caffeinated coffee before noon, and decaf after. Night and day difference (heh) in my sleep quality.

Perhaps 12pm didn't work for you because caffeine stuck around longer in your body compared to mine. Did you ever try an earlier cutoff time?

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know (2018)

#78

Post by xallarap »

trainsplanes wrote: post #74
smnplk wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did you cure your DSPD? I am asking for a friend..:P

As someone who was stuck on a 26 hour schedule for years, I just... grew out of it. One day around age 26 it just went away after having been a problem since early high school. No clue why. If you're still young, your "problem" may simply be youth.

sorry for your loss. i used to havet 26 hour rhythmics 35 years too. go eat some mars bars and find new passions maybe it comes back!

köpt mine until 35

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know (2018)

#79

Post by pengaru »

playcache wrote: post #46

I wonder how many folks that are taking Melatonin are coffee drinkers? I spent years trying to crack my sleep issues. Blackout curtains, magnesium malate / citrate, no electronic devices for an hour before bed, CBD oil, even stronger CBD oil, different doses of Melatonin, 5-HTP, valerian extract, sleep apnea tests. It never really significantly occured to me that it would be coffee as I believed I had ruled this out.…

FWIW I've found supplementing Lions Mane interacts very nicely with caffeine.

It takes the edge off the caffeine high, and largely eliminates all the awful withdrawal symptoms when quitting.

For decades I stayed away from the stuff because I'm quite sensitive to it and hate the quick forming dependency. Lions Mane has put it back on the table as a useful productivity boosting tool. I no longer even bat an eye about quitting cold turkey after a solid week of heavy use. If I know the next day will be the cessation day, I'll take an extra Lions Mane before bed and the next day won't even have the slightest headache.

Still waiting for the other shoe to drop on this, because so far there hasn't been any negative side effects. Though it may be worth noting when taking the supplement at night I tend to wake up in a semi lucid dreaming state, which is otherwise uncommon for me.

YMMV

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know (2018)

#80

Post by 01100011 »

jack_pp wrote: post #69
yosito wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Melatonin is not like a sleeping pill where more will necessarily make you more drowsy. It is a hormone that signals to your body that it is time to sleep. I can't find it right now, but there was a study of different doses in a large number of people that determined that just 0.2mg was more effective than larger doses for most people. And I've found that's true for me too. When I use melatonin, I use 0.2mg, and I fa…

How do you dose it though? Lowest dose I can find is 1mg pills and even those are pretty rare in my country. Do you get 1mg pills, crush them and measure out on precision scales?

You can get 300mcg pills but they never seem to be the sublingual, dissolving type. The lowest I've found dissolving tablets is 1mg. I take a half or a quarter and dissolve it under my tongue. That works fine when it works. Sometimes it puts me to sleep and I sleep longer than my usual 5-6 hours while waking up with a hangover. Sometimes it just makes me sleepy for 15 minutes and then I'm wide awake. Melatonin is very hit or miss for me. I smoked a lot of pot though, and from what I hear that triggers a massive melatonin release, so maybe my homeostasis is a bit messed up.

Sleep is tough. There are so many confounding factors and issues which can affect it... it's hard to find a single thing that works or that works consistently without side effects.

Post reply on HN