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Podman, the open source Docker alternative ported to M1 (Apple Silicon) machines

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Re: Podman, the open source Docker alternative ported to M1 (Apple Silicon) machines

#21

Post by cozzyd »

SilverRed wrote: post #10
infogulch wrote: post #6

Tangentially, I wonder if Moby underestimated the amount of human hours that were instantly allocated to alternatives as soon as they announced Docker Desktop was going paid. (I don't know if this project is a consequence of that announcement or not.) Hopefully Podman will be able to capitalize on this event and get the polish needed for widespread use.

I suspect the push for podman was more about how docker ignored CGroupsV2 for so long that Fedora eventually turned it on anyway which broke docker and then told users to switch to podman.

And EL8 for that matter

Re: Podman, the open source Docker alternative ported to M1 (Apple Silicon) machines

#23

Post by heavyset_go »

yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #20
jamesfinlayson wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think Mac/Darwin has cgroups but it's based on BSD to it might have jails?

So my somewhat shaky understanding is that Apple does have some form of jails in Darwin, because they use it on iOS (hence, "jailbreaking"), but for some reason doesn't ship it in desktop Darwin (aka macOS).

As far as I'm aware, macOS' sandbox isn't like the kernel namespaces and cgroups available on Linux.

Re: Podman, the open source Docker alternative ported to M1 (Apple Silicon) machines

#25

Post by kbenson »

SilverRed wrote: post #10
infogulch wrote: post #6

Tangentially, I wonder if Moby underestimated the amount of human hours that were instantly allocated to alternatives as soon as they announced Docker Desktop was going paid. (I don't know if this project is a consequence of that announcement or not.) Hopefully Podman will be able to capitalize on this event and get the polish needed for widespread use.

I suspect the push for podman was more about how docker ignored CGroupsV2 for so long that Fedora eventually turned it on anyway which broke docker and then told users to switch to podman.

I think a really big part of it was where Red Hat asked Docker to accept their patch that allowed people to run docker with local registries only (no docker.io), and were told Docker would not be accepting that patch, and to go pound sand if they didn't like it (eh, so maybe not so forcefully).

The first thing I tried to figure out when looking into Docker for work was how to limit the registries it would look at to only be our own when used in production, and I was surprised to find out you can't (at least not without a hack to make it think it's using a mirror and just hitting your registry first).

Re: Podman, the open source Docker alternative ported to M1 (Apple Silicon) machines

#26

Post by slimsag »

ur-whale wrote: post #24

> the open source Docker alternative I was under the impression that docker was open source. I am mistaken?

Docker Desktop (the software people must use to run Docker under any Mac or Windows machines) is closed source.

Re: Podman, the open source Docker alternative ported to M1 (Apple Silicon) machines

#27

Post by slimsag »

mdoms wrote: post #22

Podman, the open source alternative to the open source parts of Docker. To be clear.

This looks more like the Podman version of Docker Desktop (which is closed source, and no longer free), effectively, as it's handling the virtualization aspects for you according to[0].

[0] https://twitter.com/simnalamburt/status/1434244533001224192

Re: Podman, the open source Docker alternative ported to M1 (Apple Silicon) machines

#28

Post by johncolanduoni »

yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #20
jamesfinlayson wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think Mac/Darwin has cgroups but it's based on BSD to it might have jails?

So my somewhat shaky understanding is that Apple does have some form of jails in Darwin, because they use it on iOS (hence, "jailbreaking"), but for some reason doesn't ship it in desktop Darwin (aka macOS).

It exists on macOS but doesn’t support the mount namespacing you’d need to create something like a docker container on macOS.

Re: Podman, the open source Docker alternative ported to M1 (Apple Silicon) machines

#29

Post by zapita »

Calling podman “the open-source docker alternative” is disingenuous. The Docker engine which it competes with is also open-source. The only closed Docker product is their desktop wrapper, for which podman is not an alternative.

Podman people, you’re better than this.

Re: Podman, the open source Docker alternative ported to M1 (Apple Silicon) machines

#30

Post by zapita »

slimsag wrote: post #27
mdoms wrote: post #22

Podman, the open source alternative to the open source parts of Docker. To be clear.

This looks more like the Podman version of Docker Desktop (which is closed source, and no longer free), effectively, as it's handling the virtualization aspects for you according to[0]. [0] https://twitter.com/simnalamburt/status/1434244533001224192

The Docker CLI is also available for Mac, and is open-source.
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