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An Epidemic of Wage Theft Is Costing Workers Hundreds of Millions a Year (2014)

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Re: An Epidemic of Wage Theft Is Costing Workers Hundreds of Millions a Year (2014)

#41

Post by dataflow »

ipaddr wrote: post #37
dataflow wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Maybe I should try that next time I'm in a restaurant. Perhaps ironically, people frequently place orders at restaurant and then decline to come to pick them up & pay. They restaurant still ends up providing the service they promise, and the customer declines to make the payment they promise. It's terrible, but my understanding is it's similarly quite commonplace and hardly ever prosecuted.

Because it is not a crime. You can order whatever you want unless a payment is made and product accepted a legal transaction hasn't occured. Missed items, uncooked food, poor quality are common reasons not to accept and send back. You can decide to decline the transaction at any point. What businesses do is make the person pay first. Rarely does a fastfood worker take my order.. stop.. makes my food and then asks me…

All the examples you mention are those where the customer actually intended to pay if the meal is properly cooked, and thus would have if there were no issues. Not ones where they place an order intending not to make the payment they promise to. Are you sure that isn't a crime? It sounds like fraud to me (or some other crime) but I'm not a lawyer.

The problem is likely that distinguishing these for prosecution/conviction, but that's probably a similarity with wage theft, not a dissimilarity.

Re: An Epidemic of Wage Theft Is Costing Workers Hundreds of Millions a Year (2014)

#43

Post by 11thEarlOfMar »

Shooting from the hip...

Perhaps we require CPAs to certify that their clients are not engaged in wage theft? Small businesses that do their own taxes may have an incrementally greater chance of being audited. Then, IRS audits should also look for wage theft.

Re: An Epidemic of Wage Theft Is Costing Workers Hundreds of Millions a Year (2014)

#45

Post by [deleted] »

dataflow wrote: post #41
ipaddr wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it is not a crime. You can order whatever you want unless a payment is made and product accepted a legal transaction hasn't occured. Missed items, uncooked food, poor quality are common reasons not to accept and send back. You can decide to decline the transaction at any point. What businesses do is make the person pay first. Rarely does a fastfood worker take my order.. stop.. makes my food and then asks me…

All the examples you mention are those where the customer actually intended to pay if the meal is properly cooked, and thus would have if there were no issues. Not ones where they place an order intending not to make the payment they promise to. Are you sure that isn't a crime? It sounds like fraud to me (or some other crime) but I'm not a lawyer. The problem is likely that distinguishing these for prosecution/convic…

[deleted]

Re: An Epidemic of Wage Theft Is Costing Workers Hundreds of Millions a Year (2014)

#47

Post by kennywinker »

Aunche wrote: post #29
iso1210 wrote: post #2

"Between 2012 and 2013, McDonald’s reached agreement with the Kentucky Labor Cabinet to pay $29,000 in back wages to 203 affected workers" So basically you steal the money, and if you're caught (unlikely), you just have to give it back. Maybe I should try that next time I'm in a restaurant.

The flip side of wage theft is time theft, where the employee lies about the hours they worked. In most cases, the offender just gets fired. They aren't even required to give the money back because it's generally more trouble than it's worth to make them do so.

False equivalence. Wage theft is companies using their power as an employer to rob workers. Time theft is sneaking around the edges. It’s not “pay me for this time i didn’t work or i quit”. We care about this because of the power imbalance, and it’s not present in the time theft case.

Re: An Epidemic of Wage Theft Is Costing Workers Hundreds of Millions a Year (2014)

#49

Post by Retric »

dataflow wrote: post #34
thombat wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not quite the same, since McDonalds actually enjoyed the benefit of the labor without paying. So it's as if the customers sat down and ate the meal, then declined to pay. If the cops get called the consequence is probably worse than merely having to pay what was already agreed.

Neither is a perfect analogy, but note that in your example the customer is actually depriving the restaurant of their possession of some goods without payment, i.e. it's theft. The example here is about services being rendered.

Restaurants regularly resell goods in cases like this. I’ve had it happen when I was 10 minutes late.

Worst case they can give it to workers at the end of the shift.

Re: An Epidemic of Wage Theft Is Costing Workers Hundreds of Millions a Year (2014)

#50

Post by verall »

dataflow wrote: post #34
thombat wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not quite the same, since McDonalds actually enjoyed the benefit of the labor without paying. So it's as if the customers sat down and ate the meal, then declined to pay. If the cops get called the consequence is probably worse than merely having to pay what was already agreed.

Neither is a perfect analogy, but note that in your example the customer is actually depriving the restaurant of their possession of some goods without payment, i.e. it's theft. The example here is about services being rendered.

Are you saying that labor being deprived of their, uh, labor, is not comparable to businesses being deprived of their goods?
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