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How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

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Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#341

Post by bennysomething »

andy_ppp wrote: post #221
SunlightEdge wrote: post #109

On a related point, what I'm uncertain about are the reasons for the increase in transgender kids in the west. I understand there's been a massive increase in cases for transmen in the UK and USA for example. Is this because we can identify these conditions much better now? Maybe. I don't have the background to say for sure. There is a real fear in society though that woke schools of thought are a harmful influence t…

I understand this might get downvoted and while I agree with the parent I also blame the contraceptive pill, dysregulation of hormone systems (various reasons), environmental toxins and the general malleability of people when it comes to sexuality at very young ages and for reasons we don’t understand. In my father’s generation the vast majority of men by the time they were 25 years old could grown thick beards now I…

I can't grow a beard, does this mean I have low testosterone levels? I doubt it. Pretty certain my grandad couldn't either.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#342

Post by sn41 »

choeger wrote: post #73

As someone who lives in a formerly fascist country and was born in a socialist country that borrowed many fascist tools, I can tell you all one thing: Taking control of the language is a telltale sign of a fascist movement. Whoever tries to control the language automatically stands on the wrong side of history. It is not an accident that the woke movement attacks liberties so vehemently. It is also not an accident th…

I don't agree with this fully. The most extensive language reform movement in the last 100 years was by Ataturk in Turkey. I don't think it falls into the above category. I think it is due to some form of idealism, and there are such people at all points along the political spectrum.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#343

Post by polote »

narrator wrote: post #268
SunlightEdge wrote: post #109

On a related point, what I'm uncertain about are the reasons for the increase in transgender kids in the west. I understand there's been a massive increase in cases for transmen in the UK and USA for example. Is this because we can identify these conditions much better now? Maybe. I don't have the background to say for sure. There is a real fear in society though that woke schools of thought are a harmful influence t…

If you want to go deep down the rabbit hole here, break your brain, probably ruin your career and seriously damage your ability to interact with woke culture ever again, you can listen to an interview with the author of the book, "The Transgender Industrial Complex" in which the author alleges with copious documentation that the transgender movement is complete astroturf. He did deep research to discover where the tr…

> I think it's fascinating to think that our entire culture could just be made up by a bunch of mischievous billionaires fucking with us.

Not "could" but "is".

That's how media works, if all media agree to say something wrong during some period of time, that will become true. (Example : Aztrazeneca vaccines, masks, ...). And most media belongs to billionaires. The only thing is that they don't belong to the same billionaires and thus don't most of the time push in the same direction which creates some diversity

I'm not saying this is the case here, but media and propaganda are very close things

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#344

Post by tazjin »

foxpurple wrote: post #145
biswaroop wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting you mention Russia. The leadership of Russia spends a lot of time thinking about how to denigrate LGBTQ+ folks. Racism is alive and thriving in Russia. They even recently went through the trouble of decriminalizing first time domestic violence. Could you elaborate on why you think a trip to Russia would be useful to [eta:American] progressives?

Want it even worse than just first time? I seem to remember that Russia now allows one incident of serious domestic violence per year.

Fake news, you're probably thinking about the law regulating punishment for first time offences not involving serious violence.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#345

Post by tazjin »

Epa095 wrote: post #124
biswaroop wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting you mention Russia. The leadership of Russia spends a lot of time thinking about how to denigrate LGBTQ+ folks. Racism is alive and thriving in Russia. They even recently went through the trouble of decriminalizing first time domestic violence. Could you elaborate on why you think a trip to Russia would be useful to [eta:American] progressives?

He did not say progressives, he said " anyone who spends a lot of time thinking about this type of thing", which I interpreted as the conservatives which can't stop talking about this.

In case it helps with interpreting my comment, I live in Moscow.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#346

Post by [deleted] »

newacct583 wrote: post #53
babyshake wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Specifically I meant specifying your own preferred gender pronouns in certain contexts. When enough of your peers do it, it feels downright strange to not do it even if you don't imagine anyone would have any problem deducing your gender and you wouldn't feel offended if they did happen to use the wrong gender for you. Of course it is completely fine for people to share preferred prounouns. But as pg has said the pro…

> Being required to, say, share drinking fountains or pools with people of another race should not be compared to this. Indeed. And I didn't. I said "negro". Generations of people genuinely thought that was a neutral term. They were pissed as all fuck when all of a sudden it became a symbol of centuries of oppression. And they used language exactly like yours to express their exasperation. But the words changed anywa…

[deleted]

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#347

Post by [deleted] »

MrScruff wrote: post #163
tazjin wrote: post #14

I recommend anyone who spends a lot of time thinking about this type of thing to take a break for a few months in a country that doesn't indulge it, e.g. Russia.

Indeed, there are only two positions available on any given issue and we are all compelled to pick one.

[deleted]

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#348

Post by dragonwriter »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #135
invalidOrTaken wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To an extent left and right are asymmetrical---leftist groups tend to be groups organized around being leftist as their main purpose, while "rightist" groups (churches, police unions, gun enthusiasts) tend to be rightist incidentally . Neo Nazis feel like the exception that proves the rule.

[flagged]

> The idea that Nazis are right-wing is also kind of a modern conceit.

No, its not. I mean, except in the sense that Nazi’s are generally considered part of modern history and thus any description of them could be described as a “modern conceit”.

> When FDR was President the Democrats were the party of the Klan. Does that mean the New Deal is a right-wing program, or that the KKK is a left-wing organization?

No. It means that US parties of the time leading up to the New Deal were more strongly regional than consistently ideological (the Democratic Party had very different Northern and Southern constituencies and ideologies even before the New Deal coalition), and that the New Deal itself was the trigger for the largest, longest partisan realignment (or one of the two, though the other one was arguably only possible because the New Deal realignment was still shaking out) in US history, which only finally settled down after the secondary Civil Rights realignment to a fairly stable divisions – with a clear ideological left/right configuration – in the 1990s.

> Or maybe politics can’t be divided perfectly along a one dimensional axis

It can’t, but that doesn’t mean that any of the well-known axes of politicis don’t have things, including modern and historical political parties, that clearly fit on one side. The Nazis being one that fits clearly on the right (also, the authoritarian.)

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#349

Post by chownie »

kybernetyk wrote: post #325
hnbad wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you reckon is the reason for the increase in gay kids in the west after the decriminalization of homosexuality in most western countries? Hint: it's the decriminalization and social acceptance allowing gay people to come out of the closet rather than having to pretend they're straight for fear of consequences. The kids aren't being transed. I know there are several mostly British authors having extremely loud…

> And social acceptance is the biggest contributor to reducing suicidality That’s not the proper way to treat depression. No amount of social acceptance will lower the suicide rates of people with mis/untreated depression.

It's the proper way to treat depression caused by social rejection, which is as I understand it the bulk of the motivation for suicide among trans people.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#350

Post by corobo »

joconde wrote: post #133
SunlightEdge wrote: post #109

On a related point, what I'm uncertain about are the reasons for the increase in transgender kids in the west. I understand there's been a massive increase in cases for transmen in the UK and USA for example. Is this because we can identify these conditions much better now? Maybe. I don't have the background to say for sure. There is a real fear in society though that woke schools of thought are a harmful influence t…

Alternative explanation: there have always been as many transgender kids, but they hid it because they knew they'd get bullied by everyone, including their own parents.

Slightly more morbid take on that: Folks aren't killing themselves thinking they're broken or wrong as often as they would have before treatment was more known/widespread
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