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Retailers are spending millions to combat organized theft from stores

wsj.com

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Re: Retailers are spending millions to combat organized theft from stores

#191

Post by liber8 »

pjc50 wrote: post #170
floren wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The SF city government seems to have realized that there's another way to make crime "go down": refuse to prosecute for anything, ideally make it pointless for the cops to even show up, until people stop bothering to report crime. Wow, shoplifting is at record lows!

Unintentional consequences of the California three strikes law perhaps? Prosecutors unwilling to hand out mandatory 25 year sentences for petty theft?

This is not how the three-strike law works. You don't get a life sentence for petty theft.

Under Penal Code section 667(e), you can receive a life term if you are convicted of a serious or violent felony AND you have twice before been convicted of serious and violent felonies. See https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySectio...

Re: Retailers are spending millions to combat organized theft from stores

#192

Post by blacksmith_tb »

the-dude wrote: post #98
nikanj wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same with bike theft in Vancouver. Nobody bothers reporting it, so the statistics aren’t too bad

Isn't there any incentive for your claim on your theft insurance?

It's fairly uncommon to have insurance specifically for your bicycle, so most people would be filing claims against their renters' (if they have it) or homeowners' insurance. Given the size of those deductibles ($500 is the US average for homeowners', I would think Canada is similar [1]) lots of people would just buy another bike that costs less.

1: https://www.insurance.com/home-and-renters-insurance/home-in...

Re: Retailers are spending millions to combat organized theft from stores

#193

Post by zionic »

908B64B197 wrote: post #186
legitster wrote: post #59

A friend of mine is a manager at a Safeway. He says a typical store might lose six figures worth of product in a year. In a bad neighborhood it's not uncommon to lose over a million dollars a year. They hire security personnel, but people figure out that a) even when security catches you, they are not allowed to restrain you and b) the police do not respond to shoplifters (in certain jurisdictions they are not allowe…

> In a bad neighborhood it's not uncommon to lose over a million dollars a year. Then the store closes, then you get a food desert.

Followed by a smug article decrying the entire situation from some smug blogger.

Re: Retailers are spending millions to combat organized theft from stores

#194

Post by carstenhag »

legitster wrote: post #59

A friend of mine is a manager at a Safeway. He says a typical store might lose six figures worth of product in a year. In a bad neighborhood it's not uncommon to lose over a million dollars a year. They hire security personnel, but people figure out that a) even when security catches you, they are not allowed to restrain you and b) the police do not respond to shoplifters (in certain jurisdictions they are not allowe…

Why are they not allowed to restrain a shoplifter? In Germany, that's covered by the "anyone's" right: if you see someone commit a crime, you can detain/restrain them until the police arrives. Some restrictions apply, like for example having to watch the crime yourself etc but for shop security staff it's enough rights

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Festnahme#Jedermann-Festnahme

Re: Retailers are spending millions to combat organized theft from stores

#195

Post by google234123 »

mint2 wrote: post #121
JackFr wrote: post #13

Mods, please correct headline. This hardly a story about Amazon. It's a story of how Northern California's choice not to prosecute theft has resulted in a massive increase in criminal activity. That CVS has to privately hire security in the face of $10 million/year of goods being brazenly looted out of its stores has little to do with any Amazon policy and more to do with the policies adopted by local district attorn…

How much is it DAs vs cops just not wanting to do their job to prove what they said would happen is true? Cops don’t always arrest based on the law, but what they feel like doing. See Oregon where they decided not to police proud boy protests and tend to arrest anti-white supremacist type protestors much more. How much is it the cops found they can prove their own point? If I make a bet that I’ll get last in a race,…

The DAs literally don't prosecute people. It's not the cops.

Re: Retailers are spending millions to combat organized theft from stores

#196

Post by blacksmith_tb »

valdiorn wrote: post #41
tyoma wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The felony theft limit for Texas is $2,500, but their retail establishments do not report massive shoplifting sprees. Clearly there is more than misdemeanor/felony classification at work here.

but in Texas, how likely is the staff or the store owner to be armed, and actually confront you? No way that would happen in California. I keep thinking of this event that happened to me in the UK, where laws are equally useless at preventing theft, and staff are just powerless to do anything about it. I chased down a shoplifter. I cornered him in an alley. He stopped, looked at me, and this brief conversation took p…

Likely Tesco tossed them right in the bin, however. I think it's overstating the case to claim that people robbing shops (especially big chains) is an indication that "we've completely given up on the rule of law" - at least, I find it unlikely that your erstwhile (if gormless) thief, emboldened by his huge haul of free meat and cheese, would choose next time to relieve you of your wallet. Robbing people is a much riskier game, even in a civilised (read "non-firearm-carrying") place like the UK.

Re: Retailers are spending millions to combat organized theft from stores

#197

Post by bpodgursky »

carstenhag wrote: post #194
legitster wrote: post #59

A friend of mine is a manager at a Safeway. He says a typical store might lose six figures worth of product in a year. In a bad neighborhood it's not uncommon to lose over a million dollars a year. They hire security personnel, but people figure out that a) even when security catches you, they are not allowed to restrain you and b) the police do not respond to shoplifters (in certain jurisdictions they are not allowe…

Why are they not allowed to restrain a shoplifter? In Germany, that's covered by the "anyone's" right: if you see someone commit a crime, you can detain/restrain them until the police arrives. Some restrictions apply, like for example having to watch the crime yourself etc but for shop security staff it's enough rights https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Festnahme#Jedermann-Festnahme

They're allowed in a legal sense, but the store often orders security not to physically intervene because of the potential legal liability if either party is injured.

Re: Retailers are spending millions to combat organized theft from stores

#198

Post by imgabe »

ZeroGravitas wrote: post #71
nitrogen wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's 2018. Wr're here in 2021 watching videos of stores being actively raided.

Have you got any videos of statistical trends or other evidence that what you believe is actually true? Or are we just working from viral anecdata?

Walgreens and Target and other retailers are shutting down stores and changing the hours so they close earlier. Presumably they’re not doing that because they watched a viral video.

Re: Retailers are spending millions to combat organized theft from stores

#199

Post by alamortsubite »

pandemicsyn wrote: post #160
alamortsubite wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So given the opportunity, Texan bystanders with guns would shoot unarmed shoplifters?

Nah, a big section of the class you take to get your LTC (we don't have a CCW) covers just how screwed you would be if you did so. ...but...theres dumb people everywhere, so when you decide to shop lift in Texas the risk profile is certainly different than it is in CA.

"There's dumb people everywhere, so when you shoplift in Texas" reads a lot like like "Texan bystanders would shoot shoplifters."

Re: Retailers are spending millions to combat organized theft from stores

#200

Post by DavidPeiffer »

carstenhag wrote: post #194
legitster wrote: post #59

A friend of mine is a manager at a Safeway. He says a typical store might lose six figures worth of product in a year. In a bad neighborhood it's not uncommon to lose over a million dollars a year. They hire security personnel, but people figure out that a) even when security catches you, they are not allowed to restrain you and b) the police do not respond to shoplifters (in certain jurisdictions they are not allowe…

Why are they not allowed to restrain a shoplifter? In Germany, that's covered by the "anyone's" right: if you see someone commit a crime, you can detain/restrain them until the police arrives. Some restrictions apply, like for example having to watch the crime yourself etc but for shop security staff it's enough rights https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Festnahme#Jedermann-Festnahme

It's not necessarily that they can't legally do so, but it's against the policy of every single store. If you do so as an employee, you will most likely get fired. No amount of merchandise is worth risking an employees life. Healthcare is a mess over here, but we do generally have that part right.

Restraining a shoplifter could lead to liability issues for the employer. For example, if the shoplifter injures the employee, there's a workplace injury that goes on the OSHA record, you have an employee who is out for some amount of time, it could increase insurance rates, and it could lead to the employee getting shot if the shoplifter were particularly violent.

Additionally, if the shoplifter gets injured, they may sue the store for the injury they sustained.

Most of the US does allow a citizens arrest to be performed.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizen%27s_arrest

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