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The NSA's Backdoor in Dual EC

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Re: The NSA's Backdoor in Dual EC

#61
post #24
post #3

> the field is called computer security; not computer optimism I'd like to go even further and propose the following terms: * computer wishful thinking * security by credulity * zero-skepticism proof

The NSA actually had their own term for this, NOBUS, which meant "nobody but us". They were fond of attacks that they thought nobody but the NSA could exploit. They were arrogant enough to think they were better than all adversaries.

What do you mean "were"..?

Re: The NSA's Backdoor in Dual EC

#62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This has nothing to do with brain power. This was a deliberately backdoored algorithm that any cryptographer familiar with elliptic curve cryptography could've come up with. It wasn't even good or clever, seeing as people saw through it almost immediately. The only thing it had going for it is it was plausibly deniable and that allowed the US government to force people to implement it, since nobody could prove the NS…

> The NSA doesn't break real crypto any more, they just find or make software bugs. They still can, and do break crypto. The Snowden papers (IIRC) mentioned that NSA factored a bunch of primes by throwing ridiculous amounts of compute at it: billions of dollars. With that,they could break schemes with no forward secrecy at their leisure (from all the historical internet traffic they had gathered), and they could decr…

You're describing the Diffie-Hellman story I mentioned (in a somewhat confusing way; forward secrecy isn't involved here, this isn't about breaking RSA TLS keys, and in fact DH is used in connections with forward secrecy). Again, that only works for 1024 bit DH schemes. The NSA can't factor 2048 bit keys, and they definitely can't factor 4096 bit keys. These aren't unknown capabilities; it's pretty easy to get an order of magnitude estimate on how much compute power the NSA has (spoiler alert: Google has more).

Re: The NSA's Backdoor in Dual EC

#64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This has nothing to do with brain power. This was a deliberately backdoored algorithm that any cryptographer familiar with elliptic curve cryptography could've come up with. It wasn't even good or clever, seeing as people saw through it almost immediately. The only thing it had going for it is it was plausibly deniable and that allowed the US government to force people to implement it, since nobody could prove the NS…

> The NSA doesn't break real crypto any more, they just find or make software bugs. They still can, and do break crypto. The Snowden papers (IIRC) mentioned that NSA factored a bunch of primes by throwing ridiculous amounts of compute at it: billions of dollars. With that,they could break schemes with no forward secrecy at their leisure (from all the historical internet traffic they had gathered), and they could decr…

And vulnerabilities are constantly discovered, so they can go back to the recorded internet and break it.

Re: The NSA's Backdoor in Dual EC

#65
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure there is! There are people who act with malice and sadism, people driven to harm others, people overwhelmed by greed and people consumed by a lust for power. And there are people who devote their lives to aiding others, people who are mindful of their community's needs, people who take opportunities to help others over opportunities to help themselves. All these sorts can be found across the whole spectrum of we…

While I generally agree with your take, it's important to remember that the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Sometimes the most evil actors are those knights who believe they are fighting for some great holy cause.

Like the Climate religion for instance

Re: The NSA's Backdoor in Dual EC

#66
post #61
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The NSA actually had their own term for this, NOBUS, which meant "nobody but us". They were fond of attacks that they thought nobody but the NSA could exploit. They were arrogant enough to think they were better than all adversaries.

What do you mean "were"..?

They're probably not dumb enough to think that they're so much better than their adversaries that they can do this stuff and it's fine anymore given how badly they've just been exposed in public.

Not saying that will change behaviour but it's hard even for the massively delusional to continue to really believe they can walk on water when they find themselves under it.

Re: The NSA's Backdoor in Dual EC

#67
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The attackers didn't get the keys to the back door. They actually replaced the entire door with a new door that they made, which went unnoticed (by Juniper) for 3 years, locking out the owners of the original back door too. It's a rather impressive attack.

No, the attackers just re-pinned the backdoor lock cylinder that the NSA put on their "secure" door. That's why nobody noticed. The NSA conveniently left them a door with a backdoor they could hijack in a way that is effectively invisible. Replacing the whole door would've been like replacing the entire DRBG, which would've much more likely raised alarms.

Having a convenient backdoor already integrated definitely aided the attack, but a sophisticated attacker with the ability to silently modify your codebase is a pretty bad place to start from regardless.

Re: The NSA's Backdoor in Dual EC

#68
post #2

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1433470109742518273.html

thread reader app is missing the addendum.

Quote: "Addendum: the White House Press Secretary was asked about this story, and their answer is “please stop asking about this story.” h/t " - https://youtu.be/Hfa6bih_gVc?t=1740

That's f*ing hilarious

Re: The NSA's Backdoor in Dual EC

#70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What does twitter offer that other platforms don't? Its audience.

Twitter has made it too annoying to use their site without an account. I'm no longer part of that audience.

Nobody goes there any more, it's too crowded
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