How I Write Code: Pen and Paper • Hacker News Board

Re: How I Write Code: Pen and Paper

#81

Post by mbjdesign » Fri, Sep 03, 2021, 12:18 PM UTC

icelandicmoss wrote: post #69

It's fun to see someone else that does this! I also write code with pen and paper. Mainly for work, but I have good memories of a holiday with a notepad and The Little Schemer (with a long till receipt to cover up the answers column). Similarly I sometimes code review by printing out diffs and writing on them. I like the tactile side of writing, and the spatial freedom. Also I just find it easier to think away from a…

I've got a similar memory:

I can forget almost anything no matter how obvious, but if it's linked to a location or is spacial then my recall is spot on. I can't tell you anything about 90% of my education but could give you exact waypoints for a 3 day walk I did over 15 years ago.

I've tried harnessing this ability with the 'mind-palace" techniques where information is associated with a visualised place. I worked at a large outdoor store for a few years with a huge stockroom and used that as my base. As I was learning programming I assigned topics to sections of the stock room and related concepts with specific products. Sounds nutty but it did seem to work (I can still recall all this information).

Remembering things this way fell by the wayside though as it requires very intentional "remembering" in the first instance. It's exactly like filing — you have to do it upfront. I never used it enough that this became second nature.

I do write code on paper though, but I quickly realised that writing in a journal is suboptimal for me. When I studied design we were encouraged to take notes on loose-leaf paper both to reduce the "preciousness" that comes with bound notebooks and so that we could reorder pages but also spread it out for a high-level view. For this reason my preference is writing code on index cards where each card is a data structure or function which then get grouped into modules (thinking Elixir here).

Despite this preference I tend to just use a notebook for scribbles and "working memory" notes because I'm prone to losing cards. I've toyed with the idea of a huge blackboard and post-it notes in my office before which I may look into again soon.

Re: How I Write Code: Pen and Paper

#82

Post by tonyedgecombe » Fri, Sep 03, 2021, 12:57 PM UTC

When I studied computing at school we would hand write our Fortran code on paper. After handing it in it was sent away somewhere and an operator would type it in and run it. Two weeks later we would get the result (assuming no typos).

Re: How I Write Code: Pen and Paper

#83

Post by titaniumtown » Fri, Sep 03, 2021, 1:04 PM UTC

The link doesn't seem to work.

Re: How I Write Code: Pen and Paper

#84

Post by dnh44 » Fri, Sep 03, 2021, 1:04 PM UTC

munk-a wrote: post #43

nkozyra wrote: post #31

This may seem pedantic, but this is an aspect of project management. The pen and paper aren't in the coding, they're in the design. You may be doing some abstractions/pseudo code on paper but you're not coding. You're planning. There's nothing wrong with this! I think it's a great way to operate. But it's less sexy to say "How I Plan: Pen and Paper" then to conflate it with coding. Everyone does planning. Some people…

As someone who's worked a fair bit now - coding has absolutely no value to any company. What delivers results is deploying solutions - whether those solutions are powered by hotpockets and red bull at 3AM or whether they are entirely composed of meetings discussing how to inform customers of the change - it is never "coding" that solves a problem. "Coding" is at most the effort of transcribing a solution from your br…

I seem to keep reading what appears to be this nugget of wisdom about building solutions rather than coding but I can't tell if I'm missing something or if I just consider the distinction to be sort of obvious. Can you please help explain? My reasoning is as follows.

So if you're a programmer then you're in the business of building software solutions which are generally built via writing code or script of some sort.

If the problem is best solved via a method other than writing software, then that's great. Not every problem needs software. Not every problem even needs solving either.

If however the problem does need a software solution then it's obvious that you should make sure you actually understand the problem so that you actually solve it.

I guess I just don't see how coding isn't equivalent to solution building unless what you call coding I call typing. For me thinking, researching, investigating, designing, engineering, planning, and even just "sleeping on it" are all part of the coding process.

I suppose that if the purpose of your coding is to learn or play then you might not be building a solution.

Is this just semantics or am I missing something?

Re: How I Write Code: Pen and Paper

#85

Post by fatso784 » Fri, Sep 03, 2021, 1:05 PM UTC

This paper talks about the history behind how "writing" code came to mean "typing" it. Originally, the very first programming notations were handwritten. Interestingly, they weren't called "languages" either, until FORTRAN introduced the typewriter as semi-direct input. See here: https://dl.acm.org/doi/abs/10.1145/3313831.3376731

Re: How I Write Code: Pen and Paper

#86

Post by johncoltrane » Fri, Sep 03, 2021, 1:05 PM UTC

This reminds me how much I miss the office's gigantic whiteboards.

Re: How I Write Code: Pen and Paper

#87

Post by ta988 » Fri, Sep 03, 2021, 1:10 PM UTC

dmingod666 wrote: post #64

I always feel boxed in inside an IDE -- Why can you not attach images inside IDEs? diagrams of what you want to do... I like doing this in notion -- here you can write code with the syntax highlighting and attach all sorts of stuff to the document -- once you've crystalized exactly what you want to build, you can fireup your IDE and get to work. I think it ties with the theme -- A programmers work is not to type thin…

For what it is worth I can make diagrams.net diagrams, add pictures etc in my IDE, together with bookmarks, notes, etc. (I use IntelliJ)

Re: How I Write Code: Pen and Paper

#88

Post by UK-Al05 » Fri, Sep 03, 2021, 1:18 PM UTC

Zababa wrote: post #37

klyrs wrote: post #10

It's funny, this take is way spicier than "I don't use an IDE", but the comments here are so supportive and nice.

It's because the real conflict (up front design vs finding as you code) is hidden by the small quirk of writing code with pen and paper. Rename the article "why TDD is useless", change the angle a bit and you'll create way more controversy.

Don't think it conflicts that much with TDD.

The test is the problem statement, or maybe a theorem.

You then need to figure out how to solve/prove it. You can do this on paper then type it in or directly. It doesn't really matter.

When the test goes green you know you've solved it.

Re: How I Write Code: Pen and Paper

#89

Post by criddell » Fri, Sep 03, 2021, 1:27 PM UTC

dmingod666 wrote: post #64

I always feel boxed in inside an IDE -- Why can you not attach images inside IDEs? diagrams of what you want to do... I like doing this in notion -- here you can write code with the syntax highlighting and attach all sorts of stuff to the document -- once you've crystalized exactly what you want to build, you can fireup your IDE and get to work. I think it ties with the theme -- A programmers work is not to type thin…

ImmageComments is a Visual Studio plugin that does this and it’s very good.

I use my iPad + Pencil to create sketches or I do it on paper and take a snapshot with my phone.

Re: How I Write Code: Pen and Paper

#90

Post by nkozyra » Fri, Sep 03, 2021, 1:35 PM UTC

munk-a wrote: post #43

nkozyra wrote: post #31

This may seem pedantic, but this is an aspect of project management. The pen and paper aren't in the coding, they're in the design. You may be doing some abstractions/pseudo code on paper but you're not coding. You're planning. There's nothing wrong with this! I think it's a great way to operate. But it's less sexy to say "How I Plan: Pen and Paper" then to conflate it with coding. Everyone does planning. Some people…

As someone who's worked a fair bit now - coding has absolutely no value to any company. What delivers results is deploying solutions - whether those solutions are powered by hotpockets and red bull at 3AM or whether they are entirely composed of meetings discussing how to inform customers of the change - it is never "coding" that solves a problem. "Coding" is at most the effort of transcribing a solution from your br…

> The author is conflating coding with solution planning in a pretty minor way - you're more seriously conflating coding with solution building.

I don't think so, or perhaps expressed myself poorly. Planning is a critical part of solution building. Coding is putting the pieces together.

Unless you're absolutely winging it, you're mostly doing planning and then execution. My argument is the planning - the most important part of solution building - is what's being done on paper.