Tesla is ordered to turn over Autopilot data to a federal safety agency

Filtering out is the problem that develoeprs/engineers should solve right? I can't accept the idea that the car can hit a wall because "our devs are too incompetent or we are to cheap to use better hardware" , a wall or a truck does not look like a bridge or a shadow or a sign, if the AI is too stupid then is not ready, even if is better then a drunk teen that drives a 15 years old car in some very specific situations.

The lidar/radar detects the objects the AI should label them and decide, if it can't do it then throw more video cards at it and more training or find some competent people that could use more deterministic code to reduce the complexity before the AI attempts to run.

Unless it does.

This not a feature that Autopilot or any other of the lane keeping systems have at the moment. If we are going to say that this is an issue then pretty much all lane keeping systems would have to be outlawed.

If it is really impossible for people to pay attention without their hands on the wheel at all the time then all lane keeping must be abolished or a standard needs to be established what 'paying attention' means.

Crashing into emergency vehicles happens often even without lane keeping system as well, so its a univeral problem when you have big stationary objects standing around on driving lanes.

What do people on HN actually want or expect in terms or regulation?

Here are some suggestions:

- Only allow any kind of lane keeping if a comprehensive testing that they can detect any obstetrical of any kind and have emergency breaking. This of course would simply mean less such system would be deployed as most companies don't have practical scalable solution for this as of yet.

- Only allow any kind of lane keeping if a comprehensive driver monitoring system is implemented that makes sure driver is alert. Additionally you could require wheel touches every so often in addition to that, if 'hands free' driving should not be allowed.

Tesla is in a good spot here, they have the internal cameras and already have a driver monitoring system yet despite that they have not allowed hands free driving.

Tesla new Vision Autopilot or the more extensive FSD stack (that will do highway driving with v10) should solve the stationary object problem.

I'm sure that if there was any kind of regulation, Tesla would simply comply and move on. In the worst case if regulation would somehow insist on having things named in a specific way, Tesla would just rename their features.

However the point here seems to be non of this is technological problem with Tesla, is simply a situation with no regulation and so every manufacturer picks their own solution. Tesla is the most prominent and most talked about so they are the whipping boy of anybody that wants more regulation.

The average driver thinks that they are a better driver than the average driver right?

>if autonomous driving can save 1+ life, it's better than what we have now so we should keep it and accept that crashes will occur

This argument ignores the reality of driving: by being a competent, attentive, careful driver you can avoid many classes of accident. Crashes are all about fault, and as a safe driver you can avoid most at-fault accidents. You get to avoid all the self-inflicted damage of drunk/incapacitated driving, unsafe driving for weather conditions, extreme speeding / reckless driving, etc. You still have to deal with the externalities of those, but some fraction of the time you can notice and anticipate these people on the road and stay away. Not always of course, so that still leaves some number of deaths per mile, but I'd bet that threshold is way lower than the "save one life" bar. So if you're a good driver, autonomous cars at the "current death rate" safety bar would make you less safe.

What you get by ignoring this and using the current death rate as a bar is a "transfer of deaths": you take all the deaths that were the fault of the driver (driver dies due to being drunk/high, very reckless driving, etc) and transfer them to random innocent people who were not at fault.