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Linux on the Framework Laptop

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Re: Linux on the Framework Laptop

#111

Post by pjerem »

bastardoperator wrote: post #89
amarshall wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What laptops are you comparing to? When I compared to Lenovo X series and Dell XPS, Framework came out hundreds of dollars cheaper.

If we look at a maxed out dell xps 13 with ubuntu, the cost is $1,909.00 and I can probably squeak out some additional cost with my business account. If we look at a maxed out M1 Macbook Air it's $2,049.00 with 2TB of drive space. The maxed out frame.work costs $1,917.00 with a 100 dollar deposit and that doesn't have a drive in because I don't trust WD with my data. If we add a 2 TB drive the cost is $2,316.00 or $2…

Well, the price of parts of the DIY edition are really comparable to market price.

Price is not that much higher if the promise to be able to keep upgraded is fulfilled, I totally can see this laptop being used (and upgraded) for at least a decade.

There is literally nothing on the market that is equivalent to the PC tower you upgrade through years.

And I truly love that they made the choice to use USB-C instead of proprietary connectors for the modules. It means that if the market really exists, we can hope for third party components.

Re: Linux on the Framework Laptop

#112

Post by omegalulw »

LeifCarrotson wrote: post #79
lostapathy wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I desperately want this to succeed as well. Enough that I've got a preorder that's supposed to ship this week. I'm willing to take the gamble. Sometimes you have to help fund the change you want to see in the world.

Sometimes 'funding the change you want to see' is merely to appease your own conscience; some real problems are systemic or caused by other actors. Turning a 1 L/min sink off for the 20 seconds of washing your hands doesn't matter when the farmer down the road is growing row crops in a desert with center-pivot irrigation system. But other times, like this? It's absolutely a valid approach. If a high-profile open lapt…

1 L/min is 1 L/min, and it's not a great sacrifice to turn off a faucet when you don't need it. So even if the farmer is not judiciously using water, it doesn't mean you shouldn't.

Re: Linux on the Framework Laptop

#113

Post by amarshall »

bastardoperator wrote: post #89
amarshall wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What laptops are you comparing to? When I compared to Lenovo X series and Dell XPS, Framework came out hundreds of dollars cheaper.

If we look at a maxed out dell xps 13 with ubuntu, the cost is $1,909.00 and I can probably squeak out some additional cost with my business account. If we look at a maxed out M1 Macbook Air it's $2,049.00 with 2TB of drive space. The maxed out frame.work costs $1,917.00 with a 100 dollar deposit and that doesn't have a drive in because I don't trust WD with my data. If we add a 2 TB drive the cost is $2,316.00 or $2…

These comparisons are pretty useless because “maxed-out” means different things for each model. Maxed out M1 has a whopping 16 GB RAM, XPS has 32 GB, and Framework has 64 GB.

Never mind that it doesn’t even seem you actually “maxed-out” either because I just made a XPS 13 Developer that costs US$2,459. So now you’re just comparing arbitrarily different specs.

Re: Linux on the Framework Laptop

#114

Post by Finnucane »

LeifCarrotson wrote: post #79
lostapathy wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I desperately want this to succeed as well. Enough that I've got a preorder that's supposed to ship this week. I'm willing to take the gamble. Sometimes you have to help fund the change you want to see in the world.

Sometimes 'funding the change you want to see' is merely to appease your own conscience; some real problems are systemic or caused by other actors. Turning a 1 L/min sink off for the 20 seconds of washing your hands doesn't matter when the farmer down the road is growing row crops in a desert with center-pivot irrigation system. But other times, like this? It's absolutely a valid approach. If a high-profile open lapt…

Not an entirely relevant example. The point remains: if you want the market to provide a kind of product you want, you have to cough up the bucks for it.

Re: Linux on the Framework Laptop

#115

Post by atebyagrue »

tylerscott wrote: post #43

I am currently using the DIY version running Ubuntu. I absolutely love this laptop. It had been awhile since I built a computer (let alone a laptop). The DIY kit instructions and the construction of the machine itself are very well thought out. I am very excited for a future where we can measure the lifespan of our personal electronics in decades rather than months. Congrats to the Framework team!

Same here. I never... NEVER do first run of anything, but I firmly believed in the business model, rolled the dice, and received my $1200 i7 DIY kit. Sold my 3 month old XPS-13 and haven't looked back. Deep sleep and fingerprint reader were the only things that didn't work out of the box, and the implementation (if you take a look at the forum) is trivial. I would definitely recommend it to folks.

Re: Linux on the Framework Laptop

#116

Post by getcrunk »

gtirloni wrote: post #44
filereaper wrote: post #37

I see the founder @nrp replying to a few comments here. @nrp, can you comment on upcoming models? Would love to have a 15" or 17" model with the same swappable ports but with a beefier processor and much larger memory capacities. The larger frames might allow for more ports, but I'm not sure if you're limited by the number of PCIe lanes on these processors. I think a Ryzen offering would also be welcomed. Lastly than…

Do you need more than 64GB of memory?

I think 16-32 is the sweet spot. For specific use case I could see 64. But beyond that it would be <.1% of users. Like u would want a thread ripper or 2s at that point

Re: Linux on the Framework Laptop

#117

Post by StevePerkins »

I'm all for more choice and competition in this industry, and more pressure on manufacturers to reign in consumer-hostile practices.

However, I'm not sure that I get this. At the end of the day, we're talking about an MBP-lookalike that runs Windows and has non-soldered RAM. And kinda-sorta gives you an option to run Linux without paying the Windows tax, but only if you're willing to assemble from a kit.

That's... not terribly revolutionary, sorry. System76 has been doing the Dell-close version of this for years, to a tiny niche market. The only thing new here is the Apple-clone aesthetics rather than Dell-close aesthetics.

Plus, it seems like most of the comments here are along the lines of, "Oh, I'd love to buy one if only it had a different CPU or different RAM or different screen or different keyboard, etc etc etc". The target audience for something like this are such fickle unique snowflakes, that will never be happy with something that's aimed at a broad market.

Honestly, I think the hype here benefits artificially from Apple's recent bad press, and the intensity of HN discussion on iPhone photo scanning lately. I think there's clearly a lot of ABSTRACT interest in options and competition. I just question how much CONCRETE genuine interest there is in actually purchasing this actual product.

Re: Linux on the Framework Laptop

#118

Post by zerocrates »

varispeed wrote: post #80

This is a laptop supposed to be for power users, but why does it have such a horrible keyboard layout? I mean cursors are probably the most used keys and they are tiny and you don't have dedicated keys for PgUp / PgDown, Home, End. I have money ready for a laptop, but still can't find anything on the market :/ Second deal breaker is Intel. I don't want to reward this company for doing basically nothing for 5 or so ye…

I'm just a weirdo where I actually want uniformly smaller arrows: I like the half-scale "inverted T" more than having big left/right only, and I like fn-combos for all 4 arrows for PgUp/PgDn/Home/End, it's intuitive to me for them to work that way, vs. learning wherever they happen to be when they're actual separate keys.

Apple flip-flopped on this in MacBooks going from inverted-T to full-height left/right and apparently now back, and as usual other manufacturers have seemed to follow. Just waiting for the "back again" to trickle down.

Re: Linux on the Framework Laptop

#119

Post by abdullahkhalids »

OJFord wrote: post #59
stormbrew wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm kind of surprised battery cells aren't one of the kinds of usbc case modules you can get out of the gate. Obviously they'd be a bit limited in mAh but tbh a lot of the time I'd probably be willing to sacrifice 2 or even 3 of the 4 modules for battery if I'm actually on the go. (I kind of suspect you might be limited to one though, assuming the power delivery controller can only really handle one external source o…

Would it be enough to be worthwhile at all though, even ignoring the cost of the control circuitry? (and what's the laptop going to do when it sees 5 power sources? How does it know not to charge one depleted battery module from another?)

Some thinkpads already come with two batteries. The program tlp knows how to handle charging and discharging two batteries very well. It just does them one at at time in a given order of priority.

Re: Linux on the Framework Laptop

#120

Post by getcrunk »

codethief wrote: post #88
varispeed wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would also ask for a better keyboard. The one currently offered (at least with the model I am interested in), is not fit for purpose when it comes to development.

More generally, I would love if the custom keyboard community jumped on this bandwagon and we saw ergonomic keyboards (and a trackpoint) for the Framework laptop.

That would be amazing. Omg low profile blues with a nipple. 60%kb
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