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Man can change his pupil size on command

livescience.com

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Re: Man can change his pupil size on command

#101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm surprised that that group apparently also includes me. I had an awful experience during my LASIK procedure. What should've taken a few minutes ended up taking like 40+. It was almost an hour of the doctor and nurses constantly repeating "please keep still", yet from the very start to the very end I was literally making myself as still as possible and from my perspective wasn't moving any part of my body in the sl…

Oh, man, that sounds like a nightmare. As someone with a lot of anxiety I was probably never going to do LASIK anyway, but after reading this there's absolutely no way I'd ever even consider it. And yes, when I find myself in an anxious situation I tend to cope with body movement, some of it I'm aware of, others probably not.

My LASIK experience could not have been more opposite. I remember walking in, then putting some type of clamp to keep my eyelids from closing, you look at a red dot or a couple dots, the doctor even says you can move your eyeballs around and the laser will follow it so don’t worry about it messing up the procedure.

Then the laser activates for 10 seconds or so, you smell your burning eyeball, laser does it again to your other eye. Whole procedure is done within a couple minutes.

You get half a Xanax, go home, go to sleep, and wake up with crystal clear vision like you have never seen before.

But I also watched myself get a vasectomy, so I might not be able to relate to what an anxious person might go through.

Edit: I forgot part of the procedure. The clamp that keeps your eyelids open also slices the top layer of your eyeball and flips it open for the laser to shape your cornea. The Xanax is prob to ensure you sleep and let it heal.

Re: Man can change his pupil size on command

#102
post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can change the focal point of my eyes on command to a far away point or a close one, and I have noticed that this reliably makes my pupil get slightly larger or smaller.

That's neat. I wonder if the pupil is actually changing size, or if it's the changing shape of the lens that is making it appear so. If you look into a camera lens as the focus is changed, the inner parts of the camera do appear to change size.

It's the accommodation reflex [0] at work here - pupillary constriction goes hand in hand with a shortening of the focal length of the lens, and the eyes also converge together. This is a brainstem level response, so I doubt there'd be any easy way to dissociate these movements consciously.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accommodation_reflex

Re: Man can change his pupil size on command

#103
I am not sure how ground breaking this is.

Pupils accommodate. Focusing on something far will make your pupil get larger and focusing on something near will make it get smaller.

Basically every normal person’s pupil does this. My guess is that person in the article is actually just changing focus without really thinking about it. Given that changing focus activates muscles in the eyes, you might be convinced that you are actively controlling the muscles in the eyes directly, and not through changing focus. In addition, the “finding” of this article is based entirely on the persons subjective experience.

Thus I think the professor found someone who accomodates as normal, but has a subjective sensation of controlling his pupils when he changes his focus.

Re: Man can change his pupil size on command

#104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The eye's lens is behind the iris (unlike a camera which is typically the other way around), so the optics shouldn't affect the apparent pupil size.

Whoa. I had no idea. Thanks for informing me! That's so weird. I had always assumed that the curved front surface of the eye was the lens.

You're not wrong - the cornea (front of the eye) has about 3x the refractive power of the lens. Both function as converging lenses, and the only difference is that the refractive power of the lens can be changed.

Re: Man can change his pupil size on command

#105

I've always wondered what the limits of mind over matter were. Like if I practiced every day, Could I learn to move my toes individually or with more dexterity? Could I focus on that random muscle that twitches in my leg and get it to stop, or move it myself?

To nitpick, it is not as grand as mind-over-matter, but rather conscious control of things that are normally under the control of the sympathetic or parasympathetic system. IIRC the sympathetic system is more likely to be consciously influenced. Both are vital subsystems that control things like heart rate, blood pressure, etc. that you'd rather not play too much with (although it is said that you can with deep meditation).

Your question are about different things than that, and the first one is about a different thing than the second one.

Learning to move a particular muscle you don't normally use consciously (like moving your ears or your nostrils) is indeed a matter of practice. Sometimes all it takes is getting conscious that there is a muscle there, and then you improve your feedback loop between sending a command and feeling it move.

But a muscle that uncontrollably twitches is a whole different process. For instance some muscle cramps are related to dehydration or lack of certain minerals. So the cause can be more chemical than nervous system (ie coming from the nervous system).

PS: I have no particular expertise in this area.

Re: Man can change his pupil size on command

#107

This reminds me of the Bene Gesserit and other schools that sprung up in Frank Herbert's Dune. Once computing technology was forbidden, these schools started research in 'human technologies', learning to control and use their own (or another's) body as a kind of machine. I do wonder if there is any possibility of actually doing things like extending conscious control over more bodily functions, if we were to try at i…

Yes.

Look into practices of Tibetan monks and Indian Yogis. They specifically train their bodies to do extraordinary things.

One example is that they will meditate outside in near- or sub-freezing temperatures and have cold wet sheets placed on their skin, which they will heat and dry by controlling their metabolism (no shivering involved)[1]. I'd not be surprised to find that these studies and practices were an inspiration for Herbert's idea in Dune.

[1] https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2002/04/meditation-ch...

Re: Man can change his pupil size on command

#108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, man, that sounds like a nightmare. As someone with a lot of anxiety I was probably never going to do LASIK anyway, but after reading this there's absolutely no way I'd ever even consider it. And yes, when I find myself in an anxious situation I tend to cope with body movement, some of it I'm aware of, others probably not.

My LASIK experience could not have been more opposite. I remember walking in, then putting some type of clamp to keep my eyelids from closing, you look at a red dot or a couple dots, the doctor even says you can move your eyeballs around and the laser will follow it so don’t worry about it messing up the procedure. Then the laser activates for 10 seconds or so, you smell your burning eyeball, laser does it again to y…

> You get half a Xanax, go home, go to sleep

Wait, you get the Xanax afterwards? I'd need several Xanaxen before being able to walk into the procedure.

> I might not be able to relate to what an anxious person might go through.

Yeah, I freak out even when I get my blood pressure taken. As soon as I hear them rip the velcro on the cuff I can feel my pulse rate just about double. And then they think I have high blood pressure and I have to explain that, no, when I take it at home it's actually kind of low. Adrenalin is a heck of a drug.

Re: Man can change his pupil size on command

#109
post #49

Wow! I did not know nobody could do it. I am personally more impressed by people who can move their earlobe I can't do this but I. can change my pupil size. I just somehow imagine looking farther when in front of a mirror.

I believe that would be one of the "indirect methods" that's known and described in the articles as "mental effort".

Apparently the person described in the article can do it without indirect methods, and also "feel" the muscles involved.

From what's described it's almost as natural as moving an arm for them.

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