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Post-Brexit immigration: mission accomplished?

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Re: Post-Brexit immigration: mission accomplished?

#21

Post by matthewhammond »

the_mitsuhiko wrote: post #2

The challenge with most startup/entrepreneur visas is that different countries have very different rules and people don't show for these visas and compare them. Most people are forced to go through this because they are required by one way or another to head to a country. That in turn means that there is no desire to make the process any better. Relatedly Brexit is a really odd thing. I feel like absolutely nobody is…

Brexit (and the confected anti EU sentiment that led to it) has only ever been about pointing blame at the EU to explain/distract from the UK's gradual decline. That's why nobody's happy and it'll never be done with.

Re: Post-Brexit immigration: mission accomplished?

#22

Post by collaborative »

w_t_payne wrote: post #5

Brexit was an absolute tragedy for my family. Immediately after the referendum was lost, my children and wife started to experience a level of racially motivated abuse that we had not seen before. This reached a level where my wife felt she could no longer remain in the country and arranged for us to relocate as a family to mainland Europe. The move was not kind for me, and soon after I arrived I had a breakdown and…

I'm sorry to hear that this happened to you. Brexit also put a lot of psychological pressure on my wife. She's from a Baltic country, but during Brexit, she'd constantly be asked if she was Polish for no reason at all.

-"Hi, nice to meet you"

-"Hi, are you Polish?"

Nothing against Polish people of course, but it made her start to gradually lose it. Each new instance would bring tears for days

Luckily, it seems Brexit is not on everyone's mind now. Good luck to you, try not to stress out (it's not your fault)

Re: Post-Brexit immigration: mission accomplished?

#23

Post by rich_sasha »

biscotte_ wrote: post #6

Immigration was not the main reason of voting Brexit. UKIP is not 51% of the UK electorate. I am surprised to see that, years after that vote, there are still gross misinformation circulating around it.

I felt in most pro-Brexit messages, there was an undercurrent of "...because we are better" or "and then they won't steal your jobs". EU parliament? Full of foreigners. Immigration? All foreigners. What's wrong with the steel industry? Foreigners working cheaply in other countries, or undercutting honest British workers here in Britain.

That's not to say there aren't adverse effects of internationalisation, or to belittle people who suffer from them. But this whole "taking back control" agenda was steeped with British exceptionalism and exclusivity.

Immigration was literally the sticking point of what triggered the whole shitshow. When David Cameron did his EU roadtrip to negotiate a better deal for the UK ("give us what we want or we'll leave"), there were 2 sticking point requests: lower the EU fee, and curb EU immigration. EU said no, Cameron called the talks over, and organised the sorry referendum.

Re: Post-Brexit immigration: mission accomplished?

#24

Post by adamcharnock »

Somewhat tangential, but I feel like writing it. I left the UK and moved to Portugal shortly after the Brexit vote. I brought a 6 hectare farm for mid-5-figures (for too big for one person really).

The process here was as follows:

1 - Get a 'this person really lives here' document from your local village council office (easy, done in a day)

2 - Get a tax number (easy, but may be worth taking an accountant with you, done on the spot)

3 - Go to your local city, show both documents, pay €16, they give you your 5-year residency on the spot.

Of course this is harder now the UK has actually left the EU, but still perfectly do-able as I understand it.

I also think this can be a tricker process in the big cities. Things are generally more chill in the rural area where I am. I.e. the local official had seen my face around the village and was like 'heh, you obviously live here, whatever', and didn't need to see any title deeds or rental contracts.

Re: Post-Brexit immigration: mission accomplished?

#25

Post by netcan »

bb123 wrote: post #16
rich_sasha wrote: post #4

Sad but true. I think the most fundamental change of Brexit is the overwhelming "you're not welcome" message. Visas, papers, bureaucrats, people can deal with. But the idea that you're at best tolerated so long as you pay your taxes is really off-putting (even for me, now UK citizen and long-time resident). Also, all these schemes forget that moving for a job is so much more than that - it is moving a life. Can you m…

> My impression is that another upside Silicon Valley has over the UK is that the US is genuinely a country of immigrants. Have you ever tried applying for a US Visa? The process makes the complaints of the author in this article look like a joke.

I think this is OP's point... Bureaucratic nastiness is only half the game.

Re: Post-Brexit immigration: mission accomplished?

#26

Post by gambiting »

bb123 wrote: post #19
w_t_payne wrote: post #5

Brexit was an absolute tragedy for my family. Immediately after the referendum was lost, my children and wife started to experience a level of racially motivated abuse that we had not seen before. This reached a level where my wife felt she could no longer remain in the country and arranged for us to relocate as a family to mainland Europe. The move was not kind for me, and soon after I arrived I had a breakdown and…

> all the joy, happiness and hope seems to have drained from this land. That might have more to do with the 18 months of COIVD lockdown than Brexit.

The referendum was in 2016, 4 full years before covid hit, and as an EU immigrant to the UK I can confirm the same - very soon after the vote it feels like the entire atmosphere in the country changed to be far less welcoming to immigrants.

Re: Post-Brexit immigration: mission accomplished?

#27

Post by moogly »

> demands that are almost impossible to meet (can you account for all your international travels over the past 10 years?)

Yes, easily. That's some hyperbolic braggadocio. If you're a maniacal globetrotter, sure, I can see it being annoying or maybe even difficult, but "almost impossible"? Get a grip.

Re: Post-Brexit immigration: mission accomplished?

#28

Post by frereubu »

secretsatan wrote: post #18

Speaking as a UK immigrant to Switzerland, even though it is not in the EU, Brexit is just a massive pain. Switzerland has a somewhat strained relationship with the EU, but does have lots of bilateral agreements, like free movement in the Schengen zone, now I'm not even sure if I need a passport to cross the border to France for a day trip. Not to mention job prospects, it used to be Swiss, then EU then the rest of t…

> One of the stranger conversations you can have with uk expats is those that supported brexit and are now perplexed that they suffer consequences.

As someone wrote pithily "This may not have been the Brexit that you voted for, but it was the one that I voted against."

Re: Post-Brexit immigration: mission accomplished?

#29

Post by paganel »

rich_sasha wrote: post #4

Sad but true. I think the most fundamental change of Brexit is the overwhelming "you're not welcome" message. Visas, papers, bureaucrats, people can deal with. But the idea that you're at best tolerated so long as you pay your taxes is really off-putting (even for me, now UK citizen and long-time resident). Also, all these schemes forget that moving for a job is so much more than that - it is moving a life. Can you m…

> and London was by far better than most places

Anecdotal, but London is the only European capital city where I got shouted at on he street, in the middle of day, for being a foreigner. It happened about 10 years ago and actually the shouts of the two English young-ladies were directed at my (now) ex-wife, but I was still surprised by it. If it matters it happened in a posh-ish area of the city, around Kensington, I believe. As such the anti-foreigner mania that took over a great part of the British (and especially English) electorate a few years after that didn't surprise me.

Otherwise I found London a great place, the only real cosmopolitan city left on this continent together with Istanbul (I haven't visited Moscow yet, to be honest), otherwise everything else seems rather stale (Vienna) or too self-absorbed to care about anything else outside of it (definitely Paris, maybe also Rome).

Re: Post-Brexit immigration: mission accomplished?

#30

Post by beardedman »

A palpable amount of entitlement coming from the author. I like it (sarcasm).

> can you account for all your international travels over the past 10 years

Well, absolutely.

> It has now become a long and challenging obstacle race

It has, or is it maybe quite normal?

> But it’s not only the UK — the United States has also made it difficult for founders to immigrate and settle in Silicon Valley. Like the new post-Brexit regime in the UK, it’s expensive, comes with a lot of hassle and restrictions and involves sponsoring and numerous recommendations — usually by VCs who have decided to back the company. How is the British situation any different?

Welcome to the everyday life of 3rd world nationals & yet another great example of people in the "1st world" are so completely disconnected. How dare they be asked to prove they *can enter a country (again, sarcasm).

Sincerely, an amused 3rd worlder living in the 1st world.

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