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Docker Desktop no longer free for large companies

theregister.com

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Re: Docker Desktop no longer free for large companies

#51

Post by [deleted] »

physicsguy wrote: post #43
toomuchtodo wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're doing $10M in ARR, how much engineering time are you going to spend to switch compared to paying Docker a few thousand dollars a month? Your spend on cloud and Slack (or other comms) is likely far higher. You're probably spending more on mobile/cell business service. "Docker attempting to monetize users of its product who can easily afford the cost." I mean, the terms seems reasonable, and wouldn't you rath…

My tiny part of a division of my last company made $40 million USD per year in revenue. We had ~40 employees. Getting the funding for using something like this came from a few levels up and would be in no way guaranteed.

[deleted]

Re: Docker Desktop no longer free for large companies

#52

Post by saxonww »

handrous wrote: post #50
n42 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

as soon as a viable alternative to Docker Desktop for Mac exists I am done with this company forever (and they seem to be anticipating that)

I've used Docker for years and never touched Desktop. What's indispensable about it?

It's not great, at all. But at least on Mac it's a lot easier to get going with Docker for Mac than it is to roll your own with e.g. VirtualBox. I assume it's the same on Windows.

Re: Docker Desktop no longer free for large companies

#53

Post by Macha »

emptysongglass wrote: post #41

Docker Desktop with developer environments would be a great value add if it supported Windows, macOS and Linux. As it is, we have developers in the company using Linux workstations so our Docker subscription is just for a registry. We'll be moving soon given no forthcoming Linux client.

I wonder how many people just use docker desktop as a nicely packaged installer/VM manager? I know I don't use any of the other included tools, so can't see why I'd use docker desktop on Linux myself over just install docker from my package manager (or podman in my case)

Re: Docker Desktop no longer free for large companies

#54

Post by justincormack »

glutamate wrote: post #48

If Docker wants to grow up, maybe they could start with replying to support tickets from paying customers. I have a 10 day old open ticket with no reply.

Hey sorry about that, can you send me the ticket details justin @ docker.com and I can look into it.

Re: Docker Desktop no longer free for large companies

#55

Post by toomuchtodo »

physicsguy wrote: post #43
toomuchtodo wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're doing $10M in ARR, how much engineering time are you going to spend to switch compared to paying Docker a few thousand dollars a month? Your spend on cloud and Slack (or other comms) is likely far higher. You're probably spending more on mobile/cell business service. "Docker attempting to monetize users of its product who can easily afford the cost." I mean, the terms seems reasonable, and wouldn't you rath…

My tiny part of a division of my last company made $40 million USD per year in revenue. We had ~40 employees. Getting the funding for using something like this came from a few levels up and would be in no way guaranteed.

I admit Docker will likely have to tweak their licensing model while also building relationships where there is some wiggle room for how licensing is handled (perhaps accept credit card payments from corporate users that they can expense to sidestep procurement). "Call Us For Pricing"

Re: Docker Desktop no longer free for large companies

#56

Post by throwawayy293 »

I personally support Docker Desktop for Mac for an organization of 250-300 engineers.

I have been supporting it for 2 years now. Been through all the Docker Desktop upgrades, performance issues everytthing. I have researched docker performance on macs running k3d + k3s + istio and a bunch of microservices. I have had to jump into the internals of Docker daemon and docker cli and networking to solve how docker networks are provisioned for various proxying issues.

1. Docker dragged their feet with native performance for file syncing. We have to selectively enable it and just so that it doesn't bog the machine down.

2. When running it gets the CPU running at 75-80C, causing the fan to run non-stop at 3000 rpm at least. It is definitely impact by bad macbook pro design, which is terrible at airflow and heat sink activities

3. We were on unstable for a bit to test the new file syncing approach. Docker dropped that in stable and said "deal with it"

4. The paid forced upgrade notification means that I can't peg the Docker Desktop version for the whole org at a certain version.

5. Right after we switch from the unstable to stable, the next minor version is a breaking change.

6. Number 4 would be fine it docker would keep to their guarantee of stable being stable. They do a terrible job of being backwards compatible. The current stable we had was 3.3.1. With the constant minor upgrades, and pushing people, some people went to 3.6.0. (the latest as of yesterday, Aug 30) This broke everything inexplicable with just a VM error where k3d would keep crashing. I downgraded everyone back to 3.3.1 to get teams unblocked while waiting for me to find a fix.

7. Finding a fix usually involves waiting for Docker to prioritize something but at this point I don't trust that Docker know what it is doing.

I am currently pushing for Linux laptops, hosted dev environments and reducing the need to run distributed monoliths. We shall see.

Re: Docker Desktop no longer free for large companies

#58

Post by glutamate »

justincormack wrote: post #54
glutamate wrote: post #48

If Docker wants to grow up, maybe they could start with replying to support tickets from paying customers. I have a 10 day old open ticket with no reply.

Hey sorry about that, can you send me the ticket details justin @ docker.com and I can look into it.

I have a better idea. How about you look at EVERY open ticket, starting with those from paying customers?

EDIT: Wow, they actually did this and got back to me - thank you!

Re: Docker Desktop no longer free for large companies

#59

Post by toomuchtodo »

stuff4ben wrote: post #35
toomuchtodo wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're doing $10M in ARR, how much engineering time are you going to spend to switch compared to paying Docker a few thousand dollars a month? Your spend on cloud and Slack (or other comms) is likely far higher. You're probably spending more on mobile/cell business service. "Docker attempting to monetize users of its product who can easily afford the cost." I mean, the terms seems reasonable, and wouldn't you rath…

I'll preface this by saying I'm an IBM employee. That being said your comment rubbed me the wrong way... > wouldn't you rather support Docker vs IBM (Redhat->Podman)? Podman is an open source product and Docker is not. I'd much rather support an open source project. And what's wrong with "supporting" IBM anyways? Did they hurt you in some way???

> And what's wrong with "supporting" IBM anyways? Did they hurt you in some way???

They are a dysfunctional consultancy masquerading as a technology firm, running on inertia. They are not to be supported. (Also, my genuine condolences)

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24228972

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26532125

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26869877

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22224782

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23268191

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27706128

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24471903

Re: Docker Desktop no longer free for large companies

#60

Post by solarkraft »

dpratt wrote: post #33

This appears to be cutting of their nose to spite their face. We have a team of 50+ engineers that all use Docker for Mac for daily development tasks, but I suspect that will no longer be true in a rather short amount of time. Frankly, I don’t really know if anybody actually uses the UI components for it outside of starting and stopping the engine and for basic configuration of the VM. Everything else that comes with…

> As soon as there is a viable alternative (and I’d be happy to contribute to the effort), I’ll be moving away from Docker for Mac.

I just SSH into my server. The biggest pain about macOS is that it can't easily mount SFTP.

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