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Show HN: We built an end-to-end encrypted alternative to Google Photos

news.ycombinator.com

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Re: Show HN: We built an end-to-end encrypted alternative to Google Photos

#291

Post by novok »

iknowstuff wrote: post #246

I tried it, but unfortunately the complete lack of auto-categorization in all of those e2ee photo storage apps renders them unusable for anyone with a large library. Ente is not the first one to do this, there are many others with similarly lacking UX, like MEGA. Both Apple Photos and Google Photos: 1. have easy search by location on a map of the world. 2. allow browsing to any date in an instant. 3. index photos by…

I personally would want both options. I use mylio with many similar features and it has e2ee but you manage your own space / cloud and your still paying a monthly fee.

For the non nerd friends, managing your own cloud space is mostly a non starter although. The best choice is cloud storage managed by the provider as an option, along with the self hosted option.

Re: Show HN: We built an end-to-end encrypted alternative to Google Photos

#292

Post by vishnumohandas »

istingray wrote: post #279
vishnumohandas wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Drawing a direct parallel with Google will make this difficult, since they own their storage and network infrastructure and have ways to monetize your data. But here's an explanation on why there are large gaps between plans: - Our 1TB plan costs only 3x the 100GB plan. This model works under the assumption that the average utilization of a 1TB plan (across all customers) will be ~30%. - If we were to bring in an int…

Curious about alternatives. GB to GB, other services will always be cheaper. How do you help frame pricing What about charging per picture? Likely a non-starter, but you get where I'm going with this. iPod = 1,000 songs in your pocket. If not you, someone will figure this out. Charging by the GB seems hard. What if instead your levels were: 1,000 photos 10,000 photos 100,000 photos You might get people who store supe…

I had thought about this a year ago when I was pitching the product to my parents who had no idea what a GB was. But I was put off by the possibility of abuse once I extended the framework to videos.

Re: Show HN: We built an end-to-end encrypted alternative to Google Photos

#293

Post by dddw »

joshmn wrote: post #245
vishnumohandas wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey, we're currently using two S3 compliant storage providers (Backblaze and Scaleway). I would love to talk more about how we could reduce our pricing. Please let me know if I can reach out to you over the email mentioned on your HN profile. Thanks!

More than welcome to!

Oh please do share some nice tips in this regard

Re: Show HN: We built an end-to-end encrypted alternative to Google Photos

#294

Post by novok »

vishnumohandas wrote: post #277
novok wrote: post #273

So how is it developing with flutter for an app and why not use it as the base for a desktop app vs. make a web version?

Flutter's GitHub issues seem to suggest that the framework is not yet stable on the web or desktop. Also, we wanted a web version so that customers could check out the product without having to install an app. Coming back to Flutter, I personally have high hopes for the framework. The learning curve is one of the smallest I've experienced and they have managed to create a community that actively contributes to their…

How has the developer experience on it been overall? I downloaded the flutter app from github on my machine and it's pretty extensive! I'm kind of surprised you don't have a web target just for convenience sakes, but I see your using some stuff that is more mobile focused for background task management.

Re: Show HN: We built an end-to-end encrypted alternative to Google Photos

#295

Post by saladuh »

istingray wrote: post #286
saladuh wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> without the ability to self host is a dead end Indeed, this is why you would be foolish to use Ente as you cannot self host it. At any point they can choose to lock things down, make their clients closed source, etc etc, and you'd once again need to spend time jumping ship because you'd need to find a new ecosystem. Ente is just convient and is coming at the right time (hence the massive amount of upvotes) but does…

Yes, Ente needs to have self-hosting on their roadmap or I won't support it. > What? This was extremely random and out of place with the rest of your comment. Edited to say "open source options may suck today" Thanks for giving me the chance to explain. My comment here may give more context: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28321460 I've tried NextCloud, even 1-click hosted by a third party. For all the power, it…

> not built with me in mind

Fairo

> on top of NextCloud

Not that I know of. Could have a look through the nextcloud marketplace for something or another. Tbh, I don't see any open platforms having Google/Apple photos kind of functionality for at least a little bit. Google and Apple trained their algorithms on the people using their free tiers for years. Google especially had access to so much information on the user using Google Photos that it was able to build the algorithms it has today. For an open platform to have this functionality, it would need to wait for an open source model/algorithm to exist, else it would need to build it itself by using user data (no E2EE then).

Unless Google open sourced whatever models it uses in Google Photos today, don't expect this level of searchability yet. Actually even if Google did, it would probably be so tied to Google user information and be incompatible with E2EE.

Re: Show HN: We built an end-to-end encrypted alternative to Google Photos

#296

Post by novok »

Another thing to keep in mind with this kind of software is tracking data loss, corruption and deletion. I've used photo management services before, and have had data loss that I can't explain from this year or that year. Did I delete it? Did I do a migration wrong? Did the software silently delete it? I'm not quite sure. What is even worse is you cannot get 'another copy' of these photos from elsewhere, because they're all unique.

Having a 'recycle bin' and an ability to see the history of photo deletion, modifications and imports can be useful in tracking down what causes data loss. Also having masters accessible in a simple plain directory is essential in being able to audit that the software is working correctly, can be backed up in a simple manner and if your service goes belly up, is easy to migrate from.

Another issue is bitrot. Your desktop can bitrot modify a photo, and then your photo management software detects this as the 'new version' and destroys the original good version. You have to make sure you mitigate this by storing a hash on import and restoring to the original hashed version.

Re: Show HN: We built an end-to-end encrypted alternative to Google Photos

#297

Post by chias »

chias wrote: post #92
Aspos wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have Synology, actually. Is Synology Photos trustable?

The software with these features is called Synology Moments. I use it and I mostly love it, at the very least as a backup for my Google Photos. My experience is that it works great, provided that you're on your local network. When away from home or traveling, less so. Maybe I could configure things better to alleviate that, I don't know, but I haven't managed to yet. Sharing is less convenient. Trying to share a phot…

Yeah, new version is about the same.

If you want to check it out, here's a couple photos from when I picked some peppers the other day:

https://ojensen5115.quickconnect.to/mo/sharing/pgdYsVEqu

Re: Show HN: We built an end-to-end encrypted alternative to Google Photos

#298

Post by meibo »

ncann wrote: post #278
mixmastamyk wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Curious about the details of how you were duped.

Not OP but I have had many cloud photo accounts in the past: myphotoalbum, Kodak Gallery, photobucket, Flickr and more. Eventually all of them either shut down, or got sold and became unmaintained. Google Photos and Apple's are the only ones that I can trust will still be around in 10 years' time.

Picasa as well, though Google nowadays does a pretty great job at getting all pictures you have on your account together with https://get.google.com/albumarchive/

Re: Show HN: We built an end-to-end encrypted alternative to Google Photos

#299

Post by fortran77 »

koheripbal wrote: post #19
ridaj wrote: post #13

What are your plans for when your app is found to host content such as terrorist executions, child porn, etc.? (This isn't trolling, it's something that eventually happens with every product, and I've been wanting a non-Google version myself but wondering how that kind of abuse would be dealt with.)

The answer to this question is why the only solution in the long run is local storage.

Not when you have government-mandated software checking your local files against hashes. Not today, but someday.
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