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Big company tale: six months for a list and a button

rachelbythebay.com

51–60 of 91 posts

Re: Big company tale: six months for a list and a button

#51
I've been in a small company (everything took minimum 3-6 months.

How did they survive being so inefficient? Huge gov. contracts, where everything takes time.

I mean, perfect place if you just enjoy a steady paycheck, while working on side-projects and personal stuff - but even that gets boring, real quick.

Re: Big company tale: six months for a list and a button

#52

Um so?? It was on the roadmap. They had other work to do. I get you want everything right now, but it first work that way.

I think you may have missed the point: the team with other work to do also insisted on taking on this work , and that team prevented our protagonist from taking the requisite two days to do the work.

If they were the dashboard team, I understand that they wanted to own it. Otherwise they end up being seemingly accountable for something they didn't do. Now it becomes this snowflake dashboard that is not owned by the dashboard team. Not saying they were right, just that I can see an argument.

Re: Big company tale: six months for a list and a button

#53
post #9
post #8

I have had similar experiences multiple times and you definitely learn not to really care and let it be as this is what it is. It took a bunch of teams of senior devs and other people 1 year to translate some simple excel sheet with formulas into a little Java powered site on top of a database. The cost was a few $100k and the end result was something most people here on HN can do in an afternoon (max a few days), bu…

> their PM told them to disagree with me to pump up the final bill This explains a lot of my experiences now

IMHO that would a rare to almost non-existant thing. Any sort of Mega Corp has an unending stream of IT work. There's no real need or desire to pump up the final bill. You'll make way more money in the long run coming in on time and under budget.

Re: Big company tale: six months for a list and a button

#54
post #27
post #17

I keep reading from this author and it always struck me as a very capable technical person, but as an awful person to work with. There was a piece few days ago about picking co-founder using the army way. Beside being a well written piece, it made clear one thing. The role of leaders in an organisation is to get stuff done, despite rules, regulations, hierarchy and all the whistle and bells that an organisation need…

I agree just went on to check couple of posts: https://rachelbythebay.com/w/2020/03/03/emoji/ This one stands out as "you are all dumb and I am so smart". Then also that person does not understand that one should keep hers "edgy" stuff for group of her besties. Or at least understand that other people might not be in the same context. So for the original story posted - well I don't trust the narration. It just seems…

Wow, that post is really something.

Yeah, we've probably all felt frustrated at work due to managers, coworkers, bureaucracy or something else, and sometimes we want to vent. You don't do that in the company slack, though. That's just juvenile and stupid.

This person really doesn't sound very pleasant to work with, and I don't feel inclined to believe the retelling in the OP. There are always two sides to a story.

Re: Big company tale: six months for a list and a button

#55
post #17

I keep reading from this author and it always struck me as a very capable technical person, but as an awful person to work with. There was a piece few days ago about picking co-founder using the army way. Beside being a well written piece, it made clear one thing. The role of leaders in an organisation is to get stuff done, despite rules, regulations, hierarchy and all the whistle and bells that an organisation need…

I think you wrote your approach with the best intentions. In some scenarios it may work very well for everyone. In other scenarios it looks like a person circumventing rules and hierarchy, using social manipulation and pressure tactics, and interrupting workers who need uninterrupted focus time. People who use these tactics can come across as selfish and inconsiderate. Your approach may work great for organizational work priorities and helping build motivation, but for situations of overload you may be adding to the emotional stress of overworked developers.

Re: Big company tale: six months for a list and a button

#56
post #53
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> their PM told them to disagree with me to pump up the final bill This explains a lot of my experiences now

IMHO that would a rare to almost non-existant thing. Any sort of Mega Corp has an unending stream of IT work. There's no real need or desire to pump up the final bill. You'll make way more money in the long run coming in on time and under budget.

These are often long term projects; consultancy firms, especially big ones, are very good at delivering over time and over budget and still remaining there 10+ years. They are trained to do this and do it well. Maybe it depends on the region but it's very normal in Europe anyway for the Cap Gemini's etc to do this.

Sure they have an unending stream of work, but you rather still do far less work for far more money or rather; be able to bill far more hours for the same end result is preferable for profits. The art is then to still have a ravingly enthusiastic client at the end of the project. It's an art. Or a scam. As a techie I find it the latter but I admire how they keep the client happy, time and time again.

Re: Big company tale: six months for a list and a button

#57
post #17

I keep reading from this author and it always struck me as a very capable technical person, but as an awful person to work with. There was a piece few days ago about picking co-founder using the army way. Beside being a well written piece, it made clear one thing. The role of leaders in an organisation is to get stuff done, despite rules, regulations, hierarchy and all the whistle and bells that an organisation need…

> I keep reading from this author and it always struck me as a very capable technical person, but as an awful person to work with.

the author is a big favourite of HN. they're some early-100 or so employee of Google. many of their articles reach top-5 in HN

Re: Big company tale: six months for a list and a button

#59
post #17

I keep reading from this author and it always struck me as a very capable technical person, but as an awful person to work with. There was a piece few days ago about picking co-founder using the army way. Beside being a well written piece, it made clear one thing. The role of leaders in an organisation is to get stuff done, despite rules, regulations, hierarchy and all the whistle and bells that an organisation need…

I read the thing to the end and it seemed like the requirements that the author claims were undelivered weren't mentioned until, "oh and it didn't do this other thing that we asked for". The confirmation for example, mentioned in the second-last date entry:

> turns out, no, wait, the button is there, but it doesn't ask for confirmation (as we had asked)

This could have been a much better article if it had laid out the exact requirements in the beginning instead of saying "we just need a list and a button". And while it sounds like the dashboard team really dropped the ball with a lot of things, it also sounds like they may have just not have had good a good specification of what they needed to deliver. If you tell front-end devs to deliver a page that just does this thing (and glosses over the details) they're going to spend time interpreting it how they want. A CSS bulldozer sounds excessive, but why not.

I think the company velocity would have been greatly improved if they had handed off a formal spec, broken out the chunks of work, and put them in an issue tracker.

Re: Big company tale: six months for a list and a button

#60
post #17

I keep reading from this author and it always struck me as a very capable technical person, but as an awful person to work with. There was a piece few days ago about picking co-founder using the army way. Beside being a well written piece, it made clear one thing. The role of leaders in an organisation is to get stuff done, despite rules, regulations, hierarchy and all the whistle and bells that an organisation need…

I got the same feelings. From the article: > January 29, early: there's this team that nominally owns dashboards, and they got wind of us wanting a dashboard. They want to be the ones to do it, so we meet with them to convey the request. > January 29, late: asked "dashboard team" manager if they had been able to get the network stuff talking to our server yet via chat. No reply. Am I the only one to think this is com…

If you go to another team and tell them to drop a project because you will do it for them then it is fair for them to assume that you will start working on it very soon. If you don't have the time to do a project then don't tell people they must let you do it.
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