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Arm China Has Gone Rogue

semianalysis.substack.com

151–160 of 686 posts

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#151
post #147

This article repeats “安谋科技” so many times but as far as I can tell, doesn’t mention even once how I might attempt to pronounce it or recognize when anyone else mentions it in the future. Can anyone at least provide a transliteration?

Google Translate comes up with Ammou Technology

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#152
post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Chips themselves can be sold, yes" How would even that be possible? Surely ARM's laywers are not interested in ripoff products being sold in the West.

Arm does not manufacture chips. They license IP for per chip or blanket fees. The model of many of these licenses is irrevocable. I've seen a couple different Arm licensing contracts and they're all very different so hard to make blanket statements. The Chinese entity has the right to license to all Chinese semiconductor firms who have the right to sell their chips.

I'm aware of how ARM operates. I just find it incredible that ARM would allow some entity to license its designs contrary to ARM's own intentions, or generally do anything that entity wanted to do with them, and ARM would just consent to it in places where law is enforced. I mean, shredding counterfeit imported goods has been a traditional pastime in the west.

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#153
post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What's changed? Colonialism ended. The west was not light years ahead of, say, India, when it was first colonized. In the process of colonizing it, India's industrialization was stopped. Countries didn't somehow fall into 'developed' and 'undeveloped' buckets by divine fiat. The latter tended to be invaded by the former, with the occupiers focusing more on wealth extraction, than development. Once that parasitic re…

I'm not sure if we can attribute the gap solely to colonialism. Chinese rulers back in 1890s thought the products of industrialization were simply exotic crap. They despised STEM and didn't have a single school teaching STEM (there were a few such schools due to the Western Affairs Movement, but they were not created by the government). I don't think this level of barbarian culture was caused by colonialism.

In 1890s? In other words, soon after China lost the second Opium War. The British took Hong Kong and secured their right to poison the populace with opium. Are you sure colonialism was not at play?

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#154

I'm not sure what anyone expected when we cut China off of chip IP. We did the same thing in the US, we had a policy of just straight up encouraging people to memorize patents before they immigrated over, and paying for their family to immigrate with them. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Slater

So, you contend that because the United States did something questionable 200 years ago, it's OK for China to do it in modern times. Got it.

China is playing the same game that the US used to try to get ahead of the UK. Seems like turn about being fair play. FWIW US lawmakers have the power to do something about this by creating trade blockades until equal market access is provided. Trump tried this & look how unpopular a trade war with China is. I don't think it was all just because Trump was doing it, although the US being schizophrenic about which side implements an otherwise popular policy is going to be an ongoing challenge.

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#155
post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have an honest question: why could China catch up to the western countries in many verticals and even become the dominant player, while in history the western could stay lightyears ahead of developing countries, no matter how hard the developing countries tried, with or without government interference or industrial espionage? What's changed?

We have an example most readers here are familiar with: the US ignored European (mostly British) intellectual property when they were developing and now they produce more innovation than any European country. Germany, Switzerland, and Italy also ignored patents for a while and now they are power houses when it comes to pharmaceuticals and chemicals.

> the US ignored European (mostly British) intellectual property when they were developing and now they produce more innovation than any European country.

There's this common trope, but there's two parts to IP; infringement and enforcement.

The British didn't enforce their patents. They could have, but they didn't.

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#156
https://www.eet-china.com/d/file/news/2021-08-26/20c9205f1af...

from EET China, this image look interesting. It look like ARM China plan to add additional features into ARM or is it to build different chip on top of ARM?

Question about ARM China's exclusive rights for the China market:

1. I assumed ARM China can only sell their IPs to their Chinese customers. what about the add-on? the article say they going to develop its own IPs. Can they sell those outside of China?

2. Can a product made in China use ARM China's IPs then sell it outside of China?

3. How can ARM China build its own IPs if they are based on top of ARM UK's IPs?

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#157
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Presumably Arm China would claim all legal and licensed to Arm China under Chinese law?

That's fine within China, but you specifically mentioned exports. They aren't exporting this stuff to any country outside of a small handful.

Arm China is presumably licensing to Chinese SoC designers / manufacturers whose products are then included in devices that are exported.

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#158

This article is entirely misinformed. Arm China already makes all these products, and has for years. This is a rebrand of existing products.

Rebranding in the original, cattle-branding, ownership indicating sense.

China simply stole an entire business division.

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#159
post #91

People need to wake up to the fact that China being a potential market of >1B people is an illusion. This is particularly relevant for any tech company. Let me spell it out: Chinese companies are extensions of the state. They are tools of Chinese foreign and trade policy. What cooperation you think US companies provide the US government, it is nothing in comparison. The Chinese government will ensure that no Western…

> Here's where I think this will first come to a head: I believe the US government will at some point soon decide that any person born in mainland China is a security risk as far as working on anything national security related. This will probably extend to key industries of national importance too (eg SpaceX).

Even naturalization or birth in America can't erase ties to Chinese entities, through family links for instance. Beware of double allegiances. [0]

[0] https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/former-raytheon-engineer-sent...

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#160
post #91

People need to wake up to the fact that China being a potential market of >1B people is an illusion. This is particularly relevant for any tech company. Let me spell it out: Chinese companies are extensions of the state. They are tools of Chinese foreign and trade policy. What cooperation you think US companies provide the US government, it is nothing in comparison. The Chinese government will ensure that no Western…

>any person born in mainland China is a security risk

We've staffed our campuses and laboratories with these people because there's nothing university administrators like more than cheap labour. The Chinese Communist Party has agents inside western countries who can get to these people, to say nothing of what they can do to these people's families back in mainland China.

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