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TSMC hikes chip prices up to 20% amid supply shortage

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Re: TSMC hikes chip prices up to 20% amid supply shortage

#181

Post by HanaShiratori »

zpeti wrote: post #51
officialchicken wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love how crypto has become easy-to-blame, when in fact datacenter after datacenter is being stuffed to the brim with chips for ML workloads. It's important to recognize when consumers are being squeezed by multiple market forces.

Not just ML, with everything moving to cloud services, while consumers still use phones plus laptops, the number of chips used per person more and more.

I'm not an advocate for cloud services by all means, but aren't they generally much more efficient in using their resources than traditional on premise solutions due to the sharing of the underlying infrastructure?

Re: TSMC hikes chip prices up to 20% amid supply shortage

#182

Post by phone8675309 »

drcode wrote: post #154
zigradett wrote: post #110

Bitfinex (which has been outlawed in the USA) keeps printing Tether to prop up the price of Bitcoin, graphics cards are snatched up as soon as they are manufactured, and they're using an Argentina-sized amount of power to keep the whole thing going. Yes, it works, but no one on earth will ever use these Bitcoins to buy two pizzas ever again. What's the end-game, at this point? As many bagholders as possible?

The end game is to transition to Proof of Stake, which doesn't have these problems and has other security advantages.

Cool, when is Bitcoin moving to Proof of Stake? Before or after the FSF release Hurd?

Re: TSMC hikes chip prices up to 20% amid supply shortage

#183

Post by rfd4sgmk8u »

drcode wrote: post #154
zigradett wrote: post #110

Bitfinex (which has been outlawed in the USA) keeps printing Tether to prop up the price of Bitcoin, graphics cards are snatched up as soon as they are manufactured, and they're using an Argentina-sized amount of power to keep the whole thing going. Yes, it works, but no one on earth will ever use these Bitcoins to buy two pizzas ever again. What's the end-game, at this point? As many bagholders as possible?

The end game is to transition to Proof of Stake, which doesn't have these problems and has other security advantages.

Not for Bitcoin. PoS is a broken system that reinvents oligarchies. Proof of Work is the only secure protocol that works today -- possessing the real, desirable properties like decentralization and censorship resistance.

Don't tell me about vaporware ETH2.

The end goal for Bitcoin is Dyson spheres around stars. And it can be no other way.

Re: TSMC hikes chip prices up to 20% amid supply shortage

#184

Post by minikites »

ren_engineer wrote: post #172
pcurve wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their margin is approaching 40%. They're basically printing money at this point. It's hilarious how a manufacturer can be so profitable nowadays.

"service economy" was always a meme being sold to the gullible masses, manufacturing capacity is the only thing that matters for an economy. Manufacturing has always printed the money It amazes me how the US allowed itself to be nearly deindustrialized after manufacturing effectively won them WWII and global dominance. Now the US can't even make ventilators or face masks

Capitalism contains the seeds of its own destruction. The relentless drive to shave fractions of a cent off costs in the short term creates the conditions you describe in the long term. In other words, it's like being penny wise and pound foolish on a global scale.

Re: TSMC hikes chip prices up to 20% amid supply shortage

#185

Post by floatboth »

zigradett wrote: post #110

Bitfinex (which has been outlawed in the USA) keeps printing Tether to prop up the price of Bitcoin, graphics cards are snatched up as soon as they are manufactured, and they're using an Argentina-sized amount of power to keep the whole thing going. Yes, it works, but no one on earth will ever use these Bitcoins to buy two pizzas ever again. What's the end-game, at this point? As many bagholders as possible?

Yes. Someday Tether will implode like all scams do. The results will be spectacular.

Re: TSMC hikes chip prices up to 20% amid supply shortage

#186

Post by bluecalm »

snapcaster wrote: post #171
brianwawok wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It won't if people realize that BTC is not a useful product, and the price falls to $1k or $100. At that point no one except someone stealing electricity can afford to mine, so the entire monetary system collapses and becomes worth the same as US Civil War dollars (can maybe buy a loaf of bread with a wheelbarrow full?)

Given that bitcoin has been around for 2008, at what point will you personally concede that it's not likely to happen? Why would it happen now if it didn't in the first 13 years?

Madoff's scam lasted for 17 years and only collapsed because of sharp economic downturn. It could have lasted for much longer if people suddenly didn't need the cash.

Bitcoin is often described as distributed Ponzi. There is little value (skipping over regulations is about the only thing it's useful for) and a lot artificial pumping. It will collapse when people need money for something else so either economic downturn (exactly the thing crypto believers think they are hedging against) or when it slowly goes out of fashion (probably either due to regulation catching up or something much better coming about). Till then the show goes on. Even if there is just 10% of real dollars behind those valuations it will not matter until there is a bit of a run to cash out.

Re: TSMC hikes chip prices up to 20% amid supply shortage

#187

Post by nootropicat »

cletus wrote: post #55
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #32

Supply shortage is another way of saying demand excess. I don’t see much evidence that TSMC ever really slowed production, at least for their most advanced processes that are in high demand. This is yet another way we’re all forced to pay the price for cryptocurrency. As long as GPUs are profitable for mining, they will be purchased and put to work. The saddest part is that each additional GPU added to the mining net…

I agree with this but it's even worse than that. Estimates on Bitcoin energy usage put it at over 1TW now. I believe it was comparable to the energy consumption of Argentina. Advocates will defend this by saying most energy usage is renewable. This conjures the image of someone with a bunch of solar panels but the reality is that it's primarily hydro power because that's the cheapest. Thing is, in regions with cheap…

Mining is definitely renewable UNfriendly. Hardware is too expensive to turn it down at night, or when winds are weak. It's 24/7 constant demand, the worst possible for solar/wind.

It's indeed location independent, but that's more compatible with previously uneconomical fossil fuels (eg. methane in locations where transferring it out isn't economical).

Re: TSMC hikes chip prices up to 20% amid supply shortage

#188

Post by rfd4sgmk8u »

breckenedge wrote: post #134
vimy wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Miners will probably move to Ethereum classic.

This. I have a gut feeling that a lot of mining rigs were bought with credit and haven’t paid for themselves yet. Those rigs will find a new asset to mine rather than being dumped. Outlawing mining is the only thing I see that causes prices to move downward

Like how China banned it in May, and it has been creeping back? You can't ban mining. At least not in any jurisdiction with free speech type laws. Be careful what you are asking for -- the ability to run arbitrary software should not be controlled by governments.

Re: TSMC hikes chip prices up to 20% amid supply shortage

#189

Post by tomp »

ozarkerD wrote: post #137
pcurve wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their margin is approaching 40%. They're basically printing money at this point. It's hilarious how a manufacturer can be so profitable nowadays.

Genuine question because I’m unfamiliar with the market. Why aren’t competitors undercutting these big players? 40% is ridiculous

Their competitor is Intel which stands for I am NoT really Even trying Lol

Re: TSMC hikes chip prices up to 20% amid supply shortage

#190

Post by sokoloff »

cletus wrote: post #55
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #32

Supply shortage is another way of saying demand excess. I don’t see much evidence that TSMC ever really slowed production, at least for their most advanced processes that are in high demand. This is yet another way we’re all forced to pay the price for cryptocurrency. As long as GPUs are profitable for mining, they will be purchased and put to work. The saddest part is that each additional GPU added to the mining net…

I agree with this but it's even worse than that. Estimates on Bitcoin energy usage put it at over 1TW now. I believe it was comparable to the energy consumption of Argentina. Advocates will defend this by saying most energy usage is renewable. This conjures the image of someone with a bunch of solar panels but the reality is that it's primarily hydro power because that's the cheapest. Thing is, in regions with cheap…

> entirely legitimate (eg escaping capital controls in certain currencies). Some are not (ie all the illegal usages).

NB: You just listed only illegal usages and split them into two categories.

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