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Do vision transformers see like convolutional neural networks?

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11–20 of 45 posts

Re: Do vision transformers see like convolutional neural networks?

#11
post #8

Offtopic sort of, but does anyone know if folks are working on combining vision and natural language in one model? I think that could wield some interesting results.

https://github.com/openai/CLIP

The results are quite interesting:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Art/comments/p866wv/deep_dive_meai_...

Re: Do vision transformers see like convolutional neural networks?

#13
I am much more interested if they fall for the same tricks.

For example, if it is easy to fool them with optical illusions, such as innocent images that look racy at the first glance: https://medium.com/@marekkcichy/does-ai-have-a-dirty-mind-to... CW: Even though it does not contain a single explicit picture, it might be considered NSFW (literally - as at the first glance it looks like nudity); full disclosure: I mentored the project.

Re: Do vision transformers see like convolutional neural networks?

#16
post #7

Does tesla use transformers for the auto pilot?

Doubtful. The biggest downside of transformers for vision is how ungodly long they take to produce results. Tesla has to operate in realtime.

In Karpathy’s recent AI day presentation he specifically stated they use transformers.

But not on the raw camera input — they use regnets for that. The transformers come higher up the stack:

https://youtu.be/j0z4FweCy4M

Transformers mentioned on the slide at timestamp 1:00:18.

Re: Do vision transformers see like convolutional neural networks?

#17
post #7

Does tesla use transformers for the auto pilot?

They do. Karpathy spoke about it in on Tesla AI day. They use it for transforming image space to a vector space. See: https://youtu.be/j0z4FweCy4M (timestamp 54.40 onwards)

Can you provide a more specific timestamp? 54.40 doesn't seem to mention anything about transformers, and "onwards" is two hours.

I'd be really surprised if they use transformers due to how computationally expensive they are for anything involving vision.

EDIT: Found it. 1h: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0z4FweCy4M?t=1h

Fascinating. I guess transformers are efficient.

Re: Do vision transformers see like convolutional neural networks?

#18
post #13

I am much more interested if they fall for the same tricks. For example, if it is easy to fool them with optical illusions, such as innocent images that look racy at the first glance: https://medium.com/@marekkcichy/does-ai-have-a-dirty-mind-to... CW: Even though it does not contain a single explicit picture, it might be considered NSFW (literally - as at the first glance it looks like nudity); full disclosure: I men…

I suggest you take a look at Geometric Deep Learning, but the gist here is that convolutions can be thought of as translation equivariant functions, and pooling operations as permutation invariant combinations, all operating on a graph of as many components as the number of times the operation will be output, each component is composed of the pixels that the operation will act on, so there is local information that is slowly combined through the layers, then relative positioning can be decoded when the representation is transformed into a dense 1d-vector aka flattening.

In contrast, attention mechanisms in transformers can be seen as taking into consideration dense graphs of the whole input (at least in text, I haven't really worked with vision transformers but if an attention mechanism exists then it should be similar), along with some positional encoding and a neighborhood summary.

If they indeed can be thought as stacking neighborhood summaries along with attention mechanisms, then they shouldn't fall for the same tricks since they have access to "global" information instead of disconnected components.

But take this reply with a grain of salt as I am still learning about Geometric DL. If I misunderstood something, please correct me.

Re: Do vision transformers see like convolutional neural networks?

#19

A useful HN feature would be small space to put in a summary, like the abstract: Convolutional neural networks (CNNs) have so far been the de-facto model for visual data. Recent work has shown that (Vision) Transformer models (ViT) can achieve comparable or even superior performance on image classification tasks. This raises a central question: how are Vision Transformers solving these tasks? Are they acting like con…

This would be handy, but at the same time, I think I like that not doing so encourages people to click the link and read more of the article than they might otherwise.

Re: Do vision transformers see like convolutional neural networks?

#20
post #13

I am much more interested if they fall for the same tricks. For example, if it is easy to fool them with optical illusions, such as innocent images that look racy at the first glance: https://medium.com/@marekkcichy/does-ai-have-a-dirty-mind-to... CW: Even though it does not contain a single explicit picture, it might be considered NSFW (literally - as at the first glance it looks like nudity); full disclosure: I men…

I suggest you take a look at Geometric Deep Learning, but the gist here is that convolutions can be thought of as translation equivariant functions, and pooling operations as permutation invariant combinations, all operating on a graph of as many components as the number of times the operation will be output, each component is composed of the pixels that the operation will act on, so there is local information that i…

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