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U.S. drone pilot leaks footage reveals accidental killing of children and adults

eminetra.co.uk

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Re: U.S. drone pilot leaks footage reveals accidental killing of children and adults

#221

Post by [deleted] »

randomopining wrote: post #164
marcus_holmes wrote: post #148

A Hellfire missile apparently costs $150K [0]. Given that it's apparently OK to launch one of these at a single suspected enemy informant, couldn't we have saved a lot of time, money and lives by just bribing the entire population of Afghanistan to not do things that the West doesn't like? [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AGM-114_Hellfire

So like 30-50k per person for the total cost of the war. Or 1.6k-3k per year. I guess that's doable but it's probably not a lot of money. Plus the power structures still want to take advantage of any situation, it's not like 3k is going to pacify a warlord in the country. So nope let's go with teh hellfire.

[deleted]

Re: U.S. drone pilot leaks footage reveals accidental killing of children and adults

#222

Post by coliveira »

throwaway0a5e wrote: post #155
coliveira wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> not saying that powerful countries aren't responsible No, but you're making their apology, nonetheless.

Where is he apologizing for anything? He's pointing out that "look at atrocity X" where X is fabricated or at least not what it's purported to be is a propaganda technique as old as time.

The apology is exactly there, to suggest that every or most atrocities committed by powerful countries is nothing more than a fabrication.

Re: U.S. drone pilot leaks footage reveals accidental killing of children and adults

#223

Post by tablespoon »

leesalminen wrote: post #217
2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Source please.

Seems like plain old common sense to me. You’re never going to hear the US government say it. But that doesn’t make it untrue. It’s just an inconvenient truth.

>>> The “war on terror” was not meant to stop terrorism. It was meant to fan the flames and give the US an endless war that can be fought for generations. And it worked.

>> Source please.

> Seems like plain old common sense to me. You’re never going to hear the US government say it. But that doesn’t make it untrue. It’s just an inconvenient truth.

If that's "plain old common sense," so is QAnon.

In reality they're both conspiracy theory lies that have the psychological advantage of making the world comic-book simple for their adherents.

Re: U.S. drone pilot leaks footage reveals accidental killing of children and adults

#224

Post by thaumasiotes »

Splendor wrote: post #205
thaumasiotes wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> These should be considered war crimes. It's not a war crime unless you lose the war.

The US didn't exactly "win".

It didn't lose to the extent that indemnities could be imposed on it.

Re: U.S. drone pilot leaks footage reveals accidental killing of children and adults

#225

Post by rscoots »

detaro wrote: post #219
rscoots wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea but you said the US "declared" "every" person w/ a radio a "target". This story doesn't show any of the 3 words I put in quotes. Edit: can I get an explainer on the downvotes to both my comments?

You could try to explain what you think the difference between > US declared every man with a walkie-talkie was a legitimate target. and the policy described in the article is, attempting that will likely lead you to why you are downvoted.

1. The US did not make any sort of declaration 2. Not everyone with a walkie talkie will have this new guideline applied to them. Even just going off the article, someone with a radio could be treated with suspicion by these new guidelines, as they could be a spotter. 3. They are not defacto a "target" as described above^, although that is what the poster claimed.

The poster's statement was hyperbole to the point of being an outright lie.

Re: U.S. drone pilot leaks footage reveals accidental killing of children and adults

#226

Post by detaro »

rscoots wrote: post #225
detaro wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could try to explain what you think the difference between > US declared every man with a walkie-talkie was a legitimate target. and the policy described in the article is, attempting that will likely lead you to why you are downvoted.

1. The US did not make any sort of declaration 2. Not everyone with a walkie talkie will have this new guideline applied to them. Even just going off the article, someone with a radio could be treated with suspicion by these new guidelines, as they could be a spotter. 3. They are not defacto a "target" as described above^, although that is what the poster claimed. The poster's statement was hyperbole to the point of…

they said "a legitimate target", not "everyone was targeted".

Re: U.S. drone pilot leaks footage reveals accidental killing of children and adults

#227

Post by leesalminen »

tablespoon wrote: post #223
leesalminen wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like plain old common sense to me. You’re never going to hear the US government say it. But that doesn’t make it untrue. It’s just an inconvenient truth.

>>> The “war on terror” was not meant to stop terrorism. It was meant to fan the flames and give the US an endless war that can be fought for generations. And it worked. >> Source please. > Seems like plain old common sense to me. You’re never going to hear the US government say it. But that doesn’t make it untrue. It’s just an inconvenient truth. If that's "plain old common sense," so is QAnon . In reality they're b…

Framed another way “plain old common sense” could be better worded as “using critical thinking to form an opinion about the root cause of a geopolitical clusterfuck”.

If people who have an opinion that differs from “sources” is now a Qanon believer then we’re in for a very rocky road ahead. It’s almost like we’re only allowed to have same opinion as our overlords who own the “sources” we venerate. That’s a problem.

It’s not much of a stretch to believe that defense contractors lobbied lawmakers to extend a war that made them so much money. Certainly not enough of a stretch to compare it to Qanon.

Re: U.S. drone pilot leaks footage reveals accidental killing of children and adults

#228

Post by zd123 »

torstenvl wrote: post #119
wayoutthere wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s 800,000 direct civilian combat deaths and likely several times that from the ancillary dangers of war (starvation, land mines, etc). The designation of “non civilian combatant” was grossly overapplied (see OP about “he had a radio” or “he had an AK-47” as if every Afghan household didn’t have one after 40 years of war). https://watson.brown.edu/costsofwar/

The cited source does not support the stated proposition. Your link says 335,000 civilians, and it counts all deaths, not just those caused by the U.S. I was directly involved in U.S. CIVCAS mitigation measures in a Daesh convoy engagement by U.S. air power in the summer of 2016. I cannot comment on anything that transpired within the classified space. However, there was substantial reporting on the discrepancy betwe…

I don’t think the guy is missing the point here.

Looking at the breakdown:

https://watson.brown.edu/costsofwar/files/cow/imce/papers/20...

I dont see how it can be seen as anything but a humanitarian disaster

Re: U.S. drone pilot leaks footage reveals accidental killing of children and adults

#229

Post by loonster »

queuesorcs wrote: post #211
illgenr wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you still have signed up if you knew then what you know now?

I want to preface this with the fact that a few specific incidents left me disillusioned with the military and that I don’t think people really understand just how horrible war is. That being said I wouldn’t change the decisions I made. I truly believe the work that I did was a net positive and that my work contributed to saving the lives of both military members and civilians. Unfortunately not everything goes perfe…

Back when I enlisted, I decided that I would rather live with the regrets of joining than the regrets of not joining.

Re: U.S. drone pilot leaks footage reveals accidental killing of children and adults

#230

Post by secondaryacct »

squarefoot wrote: post #101
Zenst wrote: post #55

When we often look at drones and the advent of AI and the fear of automated killing drones but lets take another perspective. AI that assists in preventing innocents being killed. Still manually controlled but an AI to override hostile action when it deems it wrong. We all focus upon AI to identify and select targets, but an AI to help identify and prevent innocents being impacted - surely that approach would be a wo…

The worst part about the use of drones is not the collateral killing of civilians and their children; if done far away it has in the long run next to zero impact on the perception of the war among the attackers families. By using drones, the attackers are safe; their families won't mourn their beloved ones who won't return back from war zone, therefore they won't experience what war really is about, which has nothing…

One would say: why isnt Afghanistan sending drones to Phoenix or San Diego? What led to this country / group of combattant to be so behind.

Im French and I live in China with a child born here. The two militaries I paid taxes to maintain are able to find ways to resist US aggression to a point where it would become really painful to treat us like they treated Afghanistan, and we are just as old as Afghanistan.

At some point, these people need to move their asses and at least ask for our help. We understand the US is a huge threat to most of us, we're ready to help, if only you make simple compromises.

But no, they ll spend their time in teenage wet dream, exploiting their population, provocking America before being ready to resist them. So they take the drone and we roll our eyes - how can people in 2021 be so blind to how to build a country...

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