Another Airbnb Victim Tells His Story: “There Were Meth Pipes Everywhere” • Hacker News Board

Re: Another Airbnb Victim Tells His Story: “There Were Meth Pipes Everywhere”

#121

Post by llambda » Sun, Jul 31, 2011, 10:28 PM UTC

tptacek wrote: post #108

chimeracoder wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Possibly, yes. But since there are so many other potentially fishy aspects of the story, let's spend our time focusing on those instead of this one.

Huh? "Fishy"? Please stop talking like that. Neither Airbnb nor "EJ" owes us the complete objective retelling of exactly what has transpired between them. When "EJ" doesn't recount absolutely every fact that isn't completely favorable to her cause of action, that doesn't make her a crook. She isn't on trial, and you aren't a jury.

But the result is that Airbnb is taking a PR beating. So if EJ is intentionally misconstruing the facts (or Airbnb for that matter) it is important and relevant.

Look, I'm not saying they [Airbnb] are doing everything right. But at the same time, the renters have got to take on some responsibility for handing out their keys to strangers; yes that's what you're doing, is that a surprise?

This isn't all on EJ or all on Airbnb. Clearly the responsibility goes both ways, but while neither side is absolved of responsibility, EJ must back off on laying the blame on Airbnb so intensely and without remorse. Previously she stated they offered "emotionally and financially" support and were extremely helpful, only now there's veritable lynch mob has she backtracked on those statements.

Still I think Airbnb has a lot to answer for: their statements have been inconsistent.

Re: Another Airbnb Victim Tells His Story: “There Were Meth Pipes Everywhere”

#122

Post by tptacek » Sun, Jul 31, 2011, 10:32 PM UTC

llambda wrote: post #121

tptacek wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh? "Fishy"? Please stop talking like that. Neither Airbnb nor "EJ" owes us the complete objective retelling of exactly what has transpired between them. When "EJ" doesn't recount absolutely every fact that isn't completely favorable to her cause of action, that doesn't make her a crook. She isn't on trial, and you aren't a jury.

But the result is that Airbnb is taking a PR beating. So if EJ is intentionally misconstruing the facts (or Airbnb for that matter) it is important and relevant. Look, I'm not saying they [Airbnb] are doing everything right. But at the same time, the renters have got to take on some responsibility for handing out their keys to strangers; yes that's what you're doing, is that a surprise? This isn't all on EJ or all on…

The notion that "EJ" is in any way responsible for Airbnb's PR is one of the toxic premises leading to the "team Airbnb" vs. "team EJ" nonsense populating these threads. It leads directly to the notion that anything said about "EJ"'s case that isn't 100% favorable to "EJ" implies that she's dishonest.

Re: Another Airbnb Victim Tells His Story: “There Were Meth Pipes Everywhere”

#123

Post by msg » Sun, Jul 31, 2011, 10:35 PM UTC

allenbrunson wrote: post #37

mgkimsal wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sheesh - it was meant as a bit of a joke - hence the :)

So, it was meant to be a joke. Sadly, it wasn't a funny joke. And it adds nothing to the conversation. Hence, downvotes. HN observers often assume we don't have a sense of humor around here. Actually, I've seen a number of funny comments upvoted, and have done so many times myself. It's closer to the truth to say that most people aren't nearly as funny as they think they are.

The other problem is that it is interchangeable with many other jokes of the same flavor, ie, they were buying Facebook private shares, getting into the LinkedIn IPO, et cetera. This is a tip off that even if it's funny it might not be relevant.

See also the South Park critique of Family Guy.

Saying they were doubling down buying shares in Hilton and Motel 6 would at least have been marginally on topic. But still a bit obvious, right?

Re: Another Airbnb Victim Tells His Story: “There Were Meth Pipes Everywhere”

#124

Post by ulisesroche » Sun, Jul 31, 2011, 10:42 PM UTC

tptacek wrote: post #106

ulisesroche wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's just another assumption. But again, what makes you think there's a lawyer involved too?

A lawyer wouldn't be your first call after the police if this happened to you? It sure would be mine.

No, and neither did this guy, Troy, who also called airbnb. I don't think its a good idea to counter with more speculation.

Re: Another Airbnb Victim Tells His Story: “There Were Meth Pipes Everywhere”

#125

Post by tptacek » Sun, Jul 31, 2011, 10:45 PM UTC

ulisesroche wrote: post #124

tptacek wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lawyer wouldn't be your first call after the police if this happened to you? It sure would be mine.

No, and neither did this guy, Troy, who also called airbnb. I don't think its a good idea to counter with more speculation.

I'm going to go ahead and assume that EJ has at least as much legal representation as I'd have any time I ended a lease with a significant security deposit, and if you don't think that's reasonable, I don't care; I simply think you're wrong. The world will nonetheless continue turning on its axis.

Re: Another Airbnb Victim Tells His Story: “There Were Meth Pipes Everywhere”

#126

Post by [deleted] » Sun, Jul 31, 2011, 10:50 PM UTC

tptacek wrote: post #110

dspillett wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, depending on the damage done the house might be fit for occupation until some work it done.

It's also possible that she's been advised that having the place fixed up herself might establish an unnecessarily low basis for damages; fixing things up herself requires her to fit repairs into her own current budget. Think this is far fetched? It's exactly how every security deposit negotiation works, and why you should repair, clean, and document everything needed to return your apartment to reasonable condition…

[deleted]

Re: Another Airbnb Victim Tells His Story: “There Were Meth Pipes Everywhere”

#127

Post by rdouble » Sun, Jul 31, 2011, 10:50 PM UTC

timr wrote: post #56

cletus wrote: post #18

As much as some people might view this as "sometimes things go wrong", which is basically true, that's not the whole story. The story here is that people are doing things that in most jurisdictions are illegal. AirBnB is profiting off this. Do something illegal and you can't insure against any negative consequences. The whole EJ situation is a potential inflection point. Without knowing the full facts (which no one s…

"But there's something "off" about EJ's position here. Why is a vandalized apartment leaving her homeless?" Put yourself in the position of a person who has just had their apartment burglarized (remember: they stole her personal documents and valuables) and their keys stolen by probable drug addicts. Also, remember that the police have arrested one of the vandals, but probably not all of them. Ignoring, for the momen…

My apartment in San Francisco was burglarized in a similar manner,without the assistance of AirBnB. I did not develop PTSD. Based off my own experience, I also find that something seems off about EJ's story. I've found the internet's response at least strange as the incident itself.

Re: Another Airbnb Victim Tells His Story: “There Were Meth Pipes Everywhere”

#128

Post by [deleted] » Sun, Jul 31, 2011, 10:51 PM UTC

tptacek wrote: post #122

llambda wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But the result is that Airbnb is taking a PR beating. So if EJ is intentionally misconstruing the facts (or Airbnb for that matter) it is important and relevant. Look, I'm not saying they [Airbnb] are doing everything right. But at the same time, the renters have got to take on some responsibility for handing out their keys to strangers; yes that's what you're doing, is that a surprise? This isn't all on EJ or all on…

The notion that "EJ" is in any way responsible for Airbnb's PR is one of the toxic premises leading to the "team Airbnb" vs. "team EJ" nonsense populating these threads. It leads directly to the notion that anything said about "EJ"'s case that isn't 100% favorable to "EJ" implies that she's dishonest.

[deleted]

Re: Another Airbnb Victim Tells His Story: “There Were Meth Pipes Everywhere”

#129

Post by TracyWilker » Sun, Jul 31, 2011, 10:56 PM UTC

I just paid $22.87 for an iPad2-64GB and my girlfriend loves her Panasonic Lumix GF 1 Camera that we got for $38.76 there arriving tomorrow by UPS. I will never pay such expensive retail prices in stores again. Especially when I also sold a 40 inch LED TV to my boss for $675 which only cost me $62.81 to buy. Here is the website we use to get it all from, GrabCent. çom

Re: Another Airbnb Victim Tells His Story: “There Were Meth Pipes Everywhere”

#130

Post by tapp » Sun, Jul 31, 2011, 11:00 PM UTC

cletus wrote: post #18

As much as some people might view this as "sometimes things go wrong", which is basically true, that's not the whole story. The story here is that people are doing things that in most jurisdictions are illegal. AirBnB is profiting off this. Do something illegal and you can't insure against any negative consequences. The whole EJ situation is a potential inflection point. Without knowing the full facts (which no one s…

> The story here is that people are doing things that in most jurisdictions are illegal.

Agreed; I believe the problems posed to AirBnB's model are more severe that most commenters seem to recognize. Further, the countermeasures many are suggesting are problematic in their own right. e.g. Troy in Techcrunch post said:

"Also, go with your gut. My gut said something wasn’t right about the people that rented my place, but I didn’t know how to handle that gut feeling..."

IANAL, but I'm pretty sure that depending on specifics, both the Fair Housing Act and the ADA can apply to hotel rentals. If you create a situation where people are empowered to decline a rental because they "got a bad gut feeling" about the renter, you open up yet another legal can of worms.

I have nothing against the AirBnB guys - I'm actually rooting for them. However I think it's time for them to step up their game and start tackling these issues head on instead of hiding from them, which seems to have been their strategy to date.