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EU to make Bitcoin traceable, ban anonymous crypto wallets

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Re: EU to make Bitcoin traceable, ban anonymous crypto wallets

#81

Post by rad_gruchalski »

sennight wrote: post #55
rad_gruchalski wrote: post #9

Everybody who ever thought that crypto currencies will not come under this scrutiny was highly delusional. All other governments will follow soon.

Are you assuming that somebody thought that? Or did somebody share that opinion with you? I don't mean some anonymous person you argued with, I'm talking about a real person. Because I was involved back in the single digit days - and I never encountered that kind of sentiment. Things have actually played out as expected: governments stalling for time in a weird prisoner's dilemma by sowing as much uncertainty possibl…

I am not assuming. People have shared that sentiment with me at the beginning of the crypto craze.

Re: EU to make Bitcoin traceable, ban anonymous crypto wallets

#82

Post by saba2008 »

nenadg wrote: post #43
nenadg wrote: post #34

Pure wapor. How will they ban anonymous wallets?

It's the same thing as if EU jumped to ban our classic, leather, pocket wallets. Pure bullshit, except if this is marketing?

Limit monthly cash withdrawals to 100 EUR

Limit cash currency exchange to 100 EUR (or just outlaw it)

Wait for some time

Retract cash being mandatory debt settling tender

Wait a little more

And then pompously declare, that only criminals need cash (not far from truth, anybody but criminals and hardcore privacy people will be driven away by then) and ban it completely.

Re: EU to make Bitcoin traceable, ban anonymous crypto wallets

#83

Post by burnished »

gfodor wrote: post #38

In other news, the government has declared by decree that nobody is allowed to memorize seed phrases anymore. Also, multiplying prime numbers is now illegal. edit: Downvotes are funny because we are almost certainly going to see laws passed in the next few years that are functionally equivalent to the rules stated above.

Yeah, it would be, if done to pursue ends that the law has deemed criminal. This isn't the gotcha you might think it is, because no one is going to bat an eye at your attempt to boil the nuance of a law out in an effort to expose some underlying paradox that only matters on a technical level. I'm not saying that the law will be wise, or efficacious, or even really pertinent, just that we already have ways of reconciling what you may perceive as being an intractable problem. Like, laws against theft don't mean that any action where I take something of yours without express permission is theft, like a genuine intent with the context that it was needed to safely handle an immediate hazard to life or limb.

That example is admittedly weak, but do you see where I'm going with that?

Re: EU to make Bitcoin traceable, ban anonymous crypto wallets

#84

Post by burnished »

kobalsky wrote: post #23
qnsi wrote: post #7

I understand anti-EU sentiment, but who uses bitcoin for something different than transfering illegal funds and speculation? I understand Ethereum and other smart contract cryptocurcies, but time when people believed Bitcoin is going to become currency are long gone

> but who uses bitcoin for something different than transfering illegal funds and speculation? A lot of people. You just have to NOT live in a country that uses a currency that could be considered a global reserve to find us.

could you elaborate? I'm ignorant. From my perspective it seems like the value of bitcoin changes too much, having risen sharply in value recently, to spend as currency, but I'm also assuming that there are other more stable options. What kind of things do you buy, and how often? What sort of things do you do considering that the value might sky-rocket or dive overnight?

Re: EU to make Bitcoin traceable, ban anonymous crypto wallets

#85

Post by meepmorp »

colinmhayes wrote: post #33
neverywhere wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mixers will be considered illegal by the EU. It sort of makes sense. Mixers are primarily used to hide one's identity when doing shady/illegal things with cryptocurrency.

What about deFi swappers?

No, they're cool with that specific kind of money laundering.

Re: EU to make Bitcoin traceable, ban anonymous crypto wallets

#86

Post by eurasiantiger »

user-the-name wrote: post #77
oceanplexian wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Governments can either get onboard, and come up with a reasonable, practical regulatory environment, or alternatively they will be left behind and Crypto will evolve to circumvent their wishes. It is a shame but the USA may end up leapfrogging the EU in the same way they have done with other innovations, like Social Media, Self Driving Cars, and other cutting edge tech. It turns out regulating entire sectors of the e…

Governments have no interest in being "ahead" in enabling fraud, crime and tax evasion.

You have a lot of trust in people. There are plenty of politicians with financial crime convictions and organised crime ties.

Re: EU to make Bitcoin traceable, ban anonymous crypto wallets

#87

Post by anm89 »

Daishiman wrote: post #58
anm89 wrote: post #30

The EU isn't doing anything to bitcoin. They have no ability to regulate bitcoin. They can make it traceable when it is held on kycd exchanges In their jurisdiction. That is a big difference

They have the same ability to regulate it as they do cash transactions. Which is to say, people will still find workarounds if they really want to take a shot at it, but forget about transacting with legit companies and institutions unless you want the spotlight shone on you.

The EU prints Euros. The EU does not in any direct way control production of bitcoin.

Custody of the two assets has bordering on nothing in common.

Exchange of the who assets has bordering on nothing in common.

Conflating them is wildly innacurate.

Re: EU to make Bitcoin traceable, ban anonymous crypto wallets

#88

Post by burnished »

nenadg wrote: post #74
burnished wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look, where I live weed was decriminalized relatively recently. I could still get weed before, but I couldn't rock up some where and get a CBD soda, or a vape cartridge, or nice edibles, or a variety of products. In the same way you say "how will they ban anonymous wallets" you might say "how do you criminalize a plant", and thats by making possession illegal and following up on that by targeting people/places they e…

Looks like a ton of bureaucracy with little or no output. I agree, might be the same thing as a war against the drugs lmfao.

well, it had a lot of output! it completely stifled a whole industry of economic activity, for one. thats sort of my point, you might not be able to make a completely 100% unbeatable ban, but you really don't need to in order to effectively stifle certain kinds of activity. like, the harder you make something to do, the fewer people are going to have the energy to do it. arguments like "why bother, you cant make it literally impossible" miss the point that you can make it difficult enough that for most people it may as well be impossible.

Re: EU to make Bitcoin traceable, ban anonymous crypto wallets

#89

Post by gfodor »

thirtyseven wrote: post #56
gfodor wrote: post #38

In other news, the government has declared by decree that nobody is allowed to memorize seed phrases anymore. Also, multiplying prime numbers is now illegal. edit: Downvotes are funny because we are almost certainly going to see laws passed in the next few years that are functionally equivalent to the rules stated above.

In other news, the government has declared by decree that you can't move objects outside of an arbitrarily defined border that a piece of paper says is someone's "house", and then exchange those objects for different pieces of paper that the very same government has declared has value.

abstracting these things to sound silly doesn't move you outside the realm of well established norms regarding the government's role in mediating property rights through force.

what I wrote above is in a totally different ballpark - and we should expect to see government laws that pop up that do in fact attempt to regulate digit memorization or multiplication.

Re: EU to make Bitcoin traceable, ban anonymous crypto wallets

#90

Post by rad_gruchalski »

eurasiantiger wrote: post #86
user-the-name wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Governments have no interest in being "ahead" in enabling fraud, crime and tax evasion.

You have a lot of trust in people. There are plenty of politicians with financial crime convictions and organised crime ties.

Cough… wirecard… cough.
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