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Samsung kills the cameras on the Galaxy Z Fold 3 if you unlock the bootloader

xda-developers.com

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Re: Samsung kills the cameras on the Galaxy Z Fold 3 if you unlock the bootloader

#31

Post by jankotek »

Abishek_Muthian wrote: post #27
danuker wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they'll try to find a way to enable the cameras on unlocked phones in the future. In the meantime, I will only buy what ACTUALLY gives me control RIGHT NOW, namely, what is supported by LineageOS: https://wiki.lineageos.org/devices/

I feel LineageOS + F-Droid is often underrated when it comes to these discussions about alternate ecosystems. If we're ready to let go of name brands, then F-Droid has some very high quality apps[1] built with passion over profit. But I agree that the initial friction to setup LineageOS on the device is far too high for a non-technical customer, Something which could be only resolved if a devices ships with LineageOS…

I had run LineageOS for some time. It works, but FDroid is missing too many apps, even opensource like Signal. I have to update apks manually every few months.

Re: Samsung kills the cameras on the Galaxy Z Fold 3 if you unlock the bootloader

#32

Post by JCWasmx86 »

devney wrote: post #24

On the surface this seems blatantly illegal: after the sale is made the no-longer-owner removes functionality. Can someone please explain how this is legally not some sort of theft, or bait-and-switch, or ... something? I read comments about firmware licensing, or Japan's camera noise thing. Those sound like Samsung problems, while disabling a camera sounds like an actionable user problem.

It's probably somewhere deep in the EULA/ToS and furthermore it is shown, while unlocking the bootloader. Whether this is legal or not, is surely an open question.

Re: Samsung kills the cameras on the Galaxy Z Fold 3 if you unlock the bootloader

#33

Post by [deleted] »

danuker wrote: post #22
ddtaylor wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The average consumer only wants to purchase the cross-section between what is the cheapest and works the best. For most consumers Open Source is not a feature.

With various right-to-repair legislation popping up everywhere, I am not so sure. Software restrictions are one way to ensure planned obsolescence.

[deleted]

Re: Samsung kills the cameras on the Galaxy Z Fold 3 if you unlock the bootloader

#34

Post by devney »

JCWasmx86 wrote: post #32
devney wrote: post #24

On the surface this seems blatantly illegal: after the sale is made the no-longer-owner removes functionality. Can someone please explain how this is legally not some sort of theft, or bait-and-switch, or ... something? I read comments about firmware licensing, or Japan's camera noise thing. Those sound like Samsung problems, while disabling a camera sounds like an actionable user problem.

It's probably somewhere deep in the EULA/ToS and furthermore it is shown, while unlocking the bootloader. Whether this is legal or not, is surely an open question.

That raises whole other legal questions....

One basic pillar of contract law basically everywhere is that one can not be bound by a contract that they didn't read, even if they signed it. Usually these cases involve coercion or not knowing the language. If nobody can read the EULA because it's 10 pages of densely written legalese, can they even be bound by it?

Since BigCo deliberately made their EULA harder to read than necessary, that probably counts as "acting in bad faith" which is an entirely different legal avenue for the EULA to be void.

Re: Samsung kills the cameras on the Galaxy Z Fold 3 if you unlock the bootloader

#35

Post by swiley »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #12

I can almost guarantee this is due to licensing issues with the camera firmware. Modern cameras aren't just hardware any more. They're a mix of hardware and advanced processing algorithms that really do make a huge difference in the final output. Those algorithms are often licensed from 3rd parties with specific licensing requirements. Sony has been reasonably good about enabling open-source and fixing these things i…

Never buy devices with non-free firmware. They're always full of garbage like this.

Re: Samsung kills the cameras on the Galaxy Z Fold 3 if you unlock the bootloader

#36

Post by sp332 »

devney wrote: post #24

On the surface this seems blatantly illegal: after the sale is made the no-longer-owner removes functionality. Can someone please explain how this is legally not some sort of theft, or bait-and-switch, or ... something? I read comments about firmware licensing, or Japan's camera noise thing. Those sound like Samsung problems, while disabling a camera sounds like an actionable user problem.

It's not really an after-sale thing. They sold a phone with a booby trap set already. If the customer springs the trap, that's a customer action, not a Samsung action.

Re: Samsung kills the cameras on the Galaxy Z Fold 3 if you unlock the bootloader

#37

Post by agilob »

jankotek wrote: post #31
Abishek_Muthian wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel LineageOS + F-Droid is often underrated when it comes to these discussions about alternate ecosystems. If we're ready to let go of name brands, then F-Droid has some very high quality apps[1] built with passion over profit. But I agree that the initial friction to setup LineageOS on the device is far too high for a non-technical customer, Something which could be only resolved if a devices ships with LineageOS…

I had run LineageOS for some time. It works, but FDroid is missing too many apps, even opensource like Signal. I have to update apks manually every few months.

Signal team fought a long war against any forks or unauthorised builds of Signal. There are (or were) FDroid repositories with Signal compatible builds, but Moxie stated that any such build will be considered malware. Signal team was making such builds increasingly difficult to produce.

Official F-Droid repo doesn't allow proprietary dependencies on which Signal depends for some messages (push?)

Re: Samsung kills the cameras on the Galaxy Z Fold 3 if you unlock the bootloader

#38

Post by arsome »

danuker wrote: post #14
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #12

I can almost guarantee this is due to licensing issues with the camera firmware. Modern cameras aren't just hardware any more. They're a mix of hardware and advanced processing algorithms that really do make a huge difference in the final output. Those algorithms are often licensed from 3rd parties with specific licensing requirements. Sony has been reasonably good about enabling open-source and fixing these things i…

> they'll try to find a way to enable the cameras on unlocked phones in the future. In the meantime, I will only buy what ACTUALLY gives me control RIGHT NOW, namely, what is supported by LineageOS: https://wiki.lineageos.org/devices/

Personally I refuse to buy any device that requires me to go crying to the manufacturer for an unlock key.

Google and OnePlus devices can be unlocked locally with no need to contact anyone and beg, so no one can refuse your unlock on a device you already paid for.

Re: Samsung kills the cameras on the Galaxy Z Fold 3 if you unlock the bootloader

#39

Post by amelius »

sneak wrote: post #30
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #12

I can almost guarantee this is due to licensing issues with the camera firmware. Modern cameras aren't just hardware any more. They're a mix of hardware and advanced processing algorithms that really do make a huge difference in the final output. Those algorithms are often licensed from 3rd parties with specific licensing requirements. Sony has been reasonably good about enabling open-source and fixing these things i…

It doesn't matter whether it's the tyranny of Samsung being dicks or the tyranny of the copyright cartel jamming the fiction that is intellectual property down our throats (and thereby being dicks) that is fucking up one's phone. Perhaps the law needs to recognize that buying hardware should come with rights to the firmware. If all hardware is useless without firmware, then all hardware is useless without additional…

I think we should have a clear separation between hardware and software companies. This is how it worked in the old days when the internet was built. Hardware companies are getting too much power over our data, and we need more freedom of choice in how our data is treated and by whom, regardless of the hardware that we own. A company can be "good" one day and "bad" the next day. We shouldn't be forced to throw away any hardware when that happens.

Does that mean concessions on how well everything is integrated (in the view of the company and some people)? Probably, but that is of minor concern imho.

Re: Samsung kills the cameras on the Galaxy Z Fold 3 if you unlock the bootloader

#40

Post by ByteWelder »

danuker wrote: post #14
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #12

I can almost guarantee this is due to licensing issues with the camera firmware. Modern cameras aren't just hardware any more. They're a mix of hardware and advanced processing algorithms that really do make a huge difference in the final output. Those algorithms are often licensed from 3rd parties with specific licensing requirements. Sony has been reasonably good about enabling open-source and fixing these things i…

> they'll try to find a way to enable the cameras on unlocked phones in the future. In the meantime, I will only buy what ACTUALLY gives me control RIGHT NOW, namely, what is supported by LineageOS: https://wiki.lineageos.org/devices/

If you want to free yourself from the clutches of Google, I recommend the LineageOS microG fork: https://lineage.microg.org/
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