The Coronavirus Is Here Forever • Hacker News Board

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#421

Post by throwaway169169 » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 4:57 PM UTC

nkohari wrote: post #291

jcrben wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nearly 300 hospitalized per day, nearly 500 dead so far. https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/07/health/children-covid-19-prot... Unknown how many will long-term health effects. Even seemingly innocuous viruses like Epstein-Barr are tied to various health problems later in life. Why should we knowingly expose an entire generation to a little understood virus?

Influenza kills thousands of people under 18 every year: https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/index.html We are actually _incredibly_ fortunate that Covid spares children to the degree that it does.

> Influenza kills thousands of people under 18 every year:

No, it does not. You didn't actually look at the numbers. One of the worst years overall shows 115 for 0-4 and 528 for 5-17:

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/2017-2018.htm

There are some years where the total is a little over a thousand, but most are well below.

Don't spread this bull.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#422

Post by lovich » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 4:58 PM UTC

ajross wrote: post #314

outside1234 wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that's unpopular. More precisely, once the vaccine is available to all age groups, the only people that need to be scared of it are the unvaccinated. And they will have had every opportunity to get vaccinated, so we shouldn't optimize for them.

Alternatively: the unvaccinated are simply mistaken, and represent people's cousins and friends and children and grandparents, and their suffering and death would represent real loss and tragedy even to people who did everything right and got their shots. The desire to see this pandemic solely in terms of an individual moral play (on all sides of the debate!) is really strong on this website, and I think it's very un…

> We're all in this together

I used to think this too, but the “Covid is a hoax” crowd have made it very clear that we are not

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#423

Post by cageface » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 4:59 PM UTC

rayiner wrote: post #372

adrr wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People aren’t scared up. Concern is around ICU usage and that elective surgery in hot areas are put on hold which include critical cancer removal surgeries. Also we have a large group of unvaccinated group which are under kids under 12. With life going back to normal, the standard diseases are back like RSV, paraflu and others. Get two at the same time and it’s a emergency room visit. Get 3 at the same time and it’s…

> It boggles my mind why there is pushback on mandating kids to wear masks in schools. It really shouldn’t if you’re an educated person who is following what scientific authorities are saying. The science here is still uncertain, but leaning towards masks for kids in schools not being worth it. See: https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2021/08/the-science-of-maski... > At the end of May, the Centers for Disease Control an…

Delta wasn’t dominant by May. Does this still hold?

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#424

Post by baron_harkonnen » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 4:59 PM UTC

martin_bech wrote: post #347

adrr wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People aren’t scared up. Concern is around ICU usage and that elective surgery in hot areas are put on hold which include critical cancer removal surgeries. Also we have a large group of unvaccinated group which are under kids under 12. With life going back to normal, the standard diseases are back like RSV, paraflu and others. Get two at the same time and it’s a emergency room visit. Get 3 at the same time and it’s…

The masks part is easy.. it has no effect.. We have been on and off masks here in Denmark, and it seems to have no effect on spread. Also mostly you get covid when not wearing one.. from a family member or a friend..

> The masks part is easy.. it has no effect..

> Also mostly you get covid when not wearing one..

The conclusion I would draw from your own beliefs here is that we should be wearing masks all the time, especially around family... not that masks don't work.

Personally while I wear a mask most of the time when out, I do feel that we really don't know as much as we'd like to think about mask efficacy. The trouble is your own reasoning here is inconsistent. Either masks don't work as well as we think and risk of infection is equally likely in public or at home, or they do work effectively but we don't wear them at important times.

The argument you should have from your own beliefs here should be for more mask wearing not less.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#425

Post by playguardin » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 4:59 PM UTC

martin_bech wrote: post #367

martin_bech wrote: post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The masks part is easy.. it has no effect.. We have been on and off masks here in Denmark, and it seems to have no effect on spread. Also mostly you get covid when not wearing one.. from a family member or a friend..

Thanks for the downvotes.. still wont make the masks work. Get vaccinated.

Bad news. The vax doesnt work either. :(

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#426

Post by GeekyBear » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 5:00 PM UTC

code4money wrote: post #403

martin_bech wrote: post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The masks part is easy.. it has no effect.. We have been on and off masks here in Denmark, and it seems to have no effect on spread. Also mostly you get covid when not wearing one.. from a family member or a friend..

"Compared with a baseline of 1-foot separation with no masks employed, particle count was reduced by 84% at 3 feet of separation and 97% at 6 feet. A modest decrease in particle count was observed when only the receiver was masked. The most substantial exposure reduction occurred when the aerosol source was masked (or both parties were masked). When both the source and target were masked, particle count was reduced b…

We no longer believe that Covid is spread by large droplets that will fall to the ground within six feet of being sneezed or coughed out. Cloth masks catch those droplets just fine.

We now know that Covid is spread by minute particles so small that they float on the air for hours. Cloth masks do not filter the air you breathe from particles of that size.

You would need an n95 mask or better to do that job.

Remember that mask wearing almost completely did away with last year's Flu season while we simultaneously had a huge Covid surge.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#427

Post by tazjin » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 5:01 PM UTC

code4money wrote: post #403

martin_bech wrote: post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The masks part is easy.. it has no effect.. We have been on and off masks here in Denmark, and it seems to have no effect on spread. Also mostly you get covid when not wearing one.. from a family member or a friend..

"Compared with a baseline of 1-foot separation with no masks employed, particle count was reduced by 84% at 3 feet of separation and 97% at 6 feet. A modest decrease in particle count was observed when only the receiver was masked. The most substantial exposure reduction occurred when the aerosol source was masked (or both parties were masked). When both the source and target were masked, particle count was reduced b…

All the pro-mask studies are like this: Some simulated situation that doesn't take into account whether spread actually happens like that in real life.

They can simulate blowing stuff through various types of filter material all they want, it doesn't change that none of the epidemiological curves reacted to mask mandates anywhere.

They do work great as an ideological symbol though, thanks to the topic's polarisation.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#428

Post by grimjack00 » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 5:01 PM UTC

JeremyNT wrote: post #415

rayiner wrote: post #372

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It boggles my mind why there is pushback on mandating kids to wear masks in schools. It really shouldn’t if you’re an educated person who is following what scientific authorities are saying. The science here is still uncertain, but leaning towards masks for kids in schools not being worth it. See: https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2021/08/the-science-of-maski... > At the end of May, the Centers for Disease Control an…

Notable is that the article is referring to a pre-delta study of elementary aged school children (elementary school normally caps out at around age 11 in the US). Young kids have long been known to be less prone to infection, less prone to suffering ill effects from infection, and less prone to spread the disease. Delta doesn't really change much of that, they are not the primary victims nor spreaders. It's the older…

> Delta doesn't really change much of that, they are not the primary victims nor spreaders. And yet, in some parts of the US, government guidance requires masks from age 2.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#429

Post by defgeneric » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 5:01 PM UTC

tzs wrote: post #344

SamBam wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since no one under 16 has been vaccinated yet, about 70% of the population is vaccinated (44M out of 67M). That might be barely enough for herd immunity for some diseases, but the case numbers in the UK are still very high and trending back upward, showing that this isn't enough for herd immunity for Covid. Hospitalization rates are also back up to significantly higher than they were this time last year. And that's w…

What's delta like for under 16? In the US through May 2021, so it might not be a good representation for delta, here were the infections, hospitalizations, and deaths per 100k for various age groups: Age Inf Hosp Deaths 0-17 37k 287 0.5 18-49 44k 1100 25 50-64 32k 2600 85 65+ 22k 5200 1140 Unless the numbers for delta are way higher, that suggests that for under 17 getting your immunity by actually getting COVID is f…

> That's what happened with the four other coronaviruses that are in wide circulations in humans. They are thought to have caused terrible pandemics when they first got to humans which were deadly in adults but not bad in children.

Yes, this is now thought to be the case for the 1889-1890 pandemic.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#430

Post by mdp2021 » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 5:02 PM UTC

crubier wrote: post #255

lokedhs wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Israel is at 68%. I wouldn't call that close to full. Portugal is at 82%, and I wouldn't even call that full.

Portugal is at 66%

Portugal: 66.5% double jab, 75.8% at-least-single-jab. (22 Aug 2021)

(I was right in front of ourworldindata.org)