581–590 of 1001 posts
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Is $19 per dose expensive? Not knowing anything about pharma costs, it seems about what it'd expect. Especially compared to the economic savings.
Wow, I agree. That seems like a deal given all the special extra cold handling you have to do with it.
People don’t want to take the vaccine because others are trying to force them to. They would say “it’s not FDA approved!” not as the core of their hesitancy, but because they were trying to be appeal to pro-vax peoples decision making framework. I don’t think we should be able to require them to. To many of you here: imagine the Trump admin trying to require you to take the vaccine in November of last year. Cities wo…
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You could pivot to many things, for example this FDA approved drug that was later retracted: https://www.fda.gov/drugs/postmarket-drug-safety-information... Or point out that the 737 MAX had approval from another federal agency. We simple can't be sure, it is personal risk management. Requiring the vaccine is silly because vaccinated people can still spread it (especially Delta), perhaps even spread it more since the…
Your personal risk management is at odds with my childs safety. Not everyone is able to be vaccinated at the moment. "In addition, a growing body of evidence suggests that mRNA COVID-19 vaccines also reduce asymptomatic infection and transmission." https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-br...
Secondly, children have a very low risk, the flu is more dangerous to them than Covid.
Thirdly, assume that the growing body of evidence is correct . The vaccinated coworker who has a new Tinder date every week and mixes with large crowds in clubs will still be a higher risk than a reclusive, un-vaccinated, masked individual.
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I'm already triple vaxxed (booster), but there are plenty of aspects to this that help drive people's fear: - Phase 3 trials for Pfizer not complete until May 2023: ( https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04368728 ) - Control group(s) were given vaccines after 14 days: ( https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2021/02/19/9691430... ) - Pfizer generates 1.9bn in revenue off of 100m doses, just in the USA alone, cre…
I know very little about this, but could someone give a good explanation on how is a drug officially approved for mass use when the manufacturer of the drug still hasn't finished their testing?
A drug should be approved once it is very likely causing more good than harm. But obviously that doesn't mean you should stop researching that drug.
What's happening here makes perfect sense. We have more than enough information to conclude that it is extremely likely that the vaccine helps a lot and causes little harm. However if there are any rare side effects then we'd still like to know that, therefore it is a good thing that the patients in the trials are still being observed for anything unusual.
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I recent came across a technique for having a more substantial discussion and it was to ask: "Well, what would it take for you to change your mind?" Not that this is a silver bullet that automatically leads to peace and harmony, but it's a step in the right direction.
That question might best be prefaced with “here’s what would change my mind… what about yours?” That formulation might come across as more curious and open rather than patronizing. Though I honestly don’t at all understand the mindset of people who don’t want the vaccine, so I have to admit this approach could quite easily still be offensive.
When it comes to the vaccine, I got the first shot (Moderna) and had such a terrible week following it that my doctor was fairly convinced I probably already had COVID. Everyone I know had a much stronger reaction to the second shot than to the first, so I've opted to remain partially vaccinated.
With Delta in full swing, I'm now reconsidering that, but am making arrangements in advance to be out of work for another week or two, as that's my expectation going in.
All of that said, the folks I know who are unvaccinated have either already had COVID, so they're just trusting their immune system, or they are in a relatively low-risk group, and are concerned about long-term vaccine side-effects. All of them are fully vaccinated in all other regards, just not with COVID. Make of that what you will, but very few of them fall into the caricatures I see bandied about in the comments here.
Incidentally, I'm also concerned about long-term side effects, but I figure at this point, we'll have to solve that problem as a society, if they ever show up enmasse.
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Why did you omit the first part of the quote? “If the public health professionals … tell me to take I will absolutely take it. But if Donald Trump tells us to take it, I’m not taking it.” I think this is a reasonable message of caution when talking about someone pushing HCQ and drinking bleach on the daily.
Does the first part matter in the context of what the OP was talking about? If Trump mandated it many would not take it on that basis alone. That’s the point I’m responding to. “If the public health professionals, if Dr. Fauci, if the Doctors, tell us we should take it, I'll be the first in line to take it, absolutely. But if Donald Trump tells us that we should take it I'm not taking it.“ Note “But if…”. That progra…
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More likely than not, they'll just move the goalposts farther and find a different excuse for not getting it.
The vaccination is still not mandatory, right? Why do you write "excuse"? Are you really so full of yourself that you can not accept that people make different decisions from yours? Why do you even care? I assume you got the vaccine for yourself. So what is the issue? Why do you have to speak about your fellow humans in such a derogatory tone?
I care because humanity has been screwed over by this virus for a year and a half now, and the virus could be completely controlled by now in any country with a sufficient vaccine supply. But it's not, because people refuse to do their part in helping to take care of their community. That's disgusting and unforgivable to me. The blame for any COVID-related death that occurs in the US now falls squarely on the shoulders of the unvaccinated.
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> I’m wondering what the odds are that people will pivot from “it’s experimental” to “it was rushed due to politics/greed”. No doubt this will be the case for some. So, you've found a logical flaw in people's stated reasons for not wanting a vaccine. How does that help anything? In these kinds of debates, the actual goals or beliefs of both sides often differ from what they say. For example, the government being able…
I recent came across a technique for having a more substantial discussion and it was to ask: "Well, what would it take for you to change your mind?" Not that this is a silver bullet that automatically leads to peace and harmony, but it's a step in the right direction.
A lot of things, but just the top two would be enough:
1) Being able to sue. If you can sue J&J for baby powder, should be able to sue Pfizer for vaccines if anything goes wrong.
2) Falsifiability in government actions. Many rights have been taken away (some permanently) by saying "we just need to do this and then it will all be over" like "a few weeks to flatten the curve", "the last lockdown", and "x% vaccinated and we'll be back to normal".
But when they don't work, the people are blamed, more rights are taken and more restrictions imposed. It's never that the actions were wrong.
I expect something like if "70% of people are vaccinated then we expect no more than 5000 cases per day" and if the statement turns out to be false there will be no more vaccine impositions because it clearly will have turned out to be wrong.
If something doesn't work you shouldn't double down.
I’m wondering what the odds are that people will pivot from “it’s experimental” to “it was rushed due to politics/greed”. I think a huge factor will be how many employers, colleges, etc. are now willing and legally able to require vaccination. It’s one thing to say you trust something you read on Facebook more than your doctor and quite another to walk away from a job because of it.
Several small startups I’ve talked to are already requiring proof of vaccination. But it’s legal and insurance demanding it, not their team. And these are for _fully remote_ positions. I suspect FAANG is finding itself in a similar position.
Tin foil hat: I’m starting to suspect someone (gov? Pharma?) is leaning on insurance companies to in turn pressure the industry to mandate vaccination.
> Walk away from a job because of it
It’s starting to seem like you’ll be free to not vaccinate in the U.S., but it’s more than walking away from a job. If insurance requires it, you’ll have to find a company that has an insurance company willing to float you an exemption for non-protected class reasons; it’s not clear how much the market is going to allow for that.
BTW: I’m vaccinated. I left my job not to avoid vaccination, but because they thought they could remove my agency.