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Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

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Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#321

Post by iluvcommunism »

teakettle42 wrote: post #130
Manuel_D wrote: post #18

This would be a serious breach of privacy if true. But reading the tweets I'm not sure what the policy really is: > During a discovery thing 3yr ago, legal forced me to hand-over all my texts. They refused to let me delete anything, even "fully personal," even when I said "by fully personal I mean nudes." They said they're in their "permanent evidence locker This doesn't sound like company policy, and more like they…

Yeah, this is simply false. Apple doesn’t expect you to use a personal iCloud account, and is very clear about warning you about sharing /storing personal data on work systems. I have very little sympathy for someone that used a personal account containing nudes on a work device. That was a work-inappropriate choice with entirely predictable results.

In this day and age, having nudes in any device connected to the cloud is irresponsible.

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#322

Post by Terretta »

snowwrestler wrote: post #180

I feel like I might be crazy but… isn’t this an issue with Apple products at work in general? I am issued a MacBook Pro and iPhone from my employer. The IT dept. configured them to connect to our corporate infrastructure: Exchange, MS365, VPN, Dropbox, Slack, printers, etc. IT did not issue me a corporate iCloud account. I can add my personal iCloud account to these devices if I want, and then I’ll get all my music,…

Don’t add your personal iCloud account even if you want.

Your goal is to not have to repurchase your music, apps, etc., but not commingle your personal photos and messages. You can do this with iCloud family child accounts.

To use “your” stuff you paid for on a “work account” they ask you to set up using alternative email address, you can make the work account be a family child account.

Then the work account can use purchases etc., and you control its access even if work attempts to take it.

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#323

Post by testfoobar »

X6S1x6Okd1st wrote: post #214
testfoobar wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I went so far as to carry two iPhones, one personal and the other "corporate," and I only ever used my "corporate" iPhone with Apple employee apps. I never even connected my personal phone to the campus WiFi; I used wireless data for that phone the entire time I was there." This is the way. Carry two devices. Separate personal/work devices. Never connect personal to corporate network. Never send messages between per…

> Don't do vacation research, medical research, social media, Spotify, anything personal at all on your work device. Ever. That's quite extreme. What is your threat model?

Bright distinctions between work and personal devices make it easier to stay disciplined.

Threat model is straightforward: I have no expectation of privacy on my work devices. I do not want my employer entangled digitally with my personal life.

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#324

Post by Terretta »

saagarjha wrote: post #269

There's a lot of people up in arms about this–either because they are mad because Apple is forcing employees to merge their accounts, or that they think this is completely false because this is not strictly required. As always, the real truth is somewhere in the middle. Apple does not mandate that you use your personal iCloud on your work device. You can absolutely make a fresh account (from a new Gmail or something)…

TL;DR: To use an iCloud personal account on corporate device =~ s/personal/child/ig.

As posted in a sibling subthread:

Don’t add your “personal” iCloud account even if you want.

Your goal is most likely to not have to repurchase your music, apps, etc., but also not commingle your personal photos and messages.

You can do this with iCloud Family “child” accounts.

To use “your” stuff you paid for on a “work account” they ask you to set up using alternative email address, you can make the work account be a family child account.

Then the work account can use purchases etc., and you control its access even if work attempts to take it.

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#325

Post by brokenmachine »

d110af5ccf wrote: post #311
brokenmachine wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no proper encryption though. In my mind, it's just like having everything unencrypted but using TLS to get it to Apple central. Apple employees can still access it. This is just ever so slightly better than the worst of everything. No real encryption, on-device scanning and scanning on Apple servers. "For privacy", WTF!!

No client side encryption yet . I can't see any reason to implement a scanner in this way other than at least having E2EE as a possibility under consideration. They knew there was the possibility for PR backlash. Doing it on device also adds significant complexity. Meanwhile scanning on upload is a very common and well accepted (both legally and socially) practice. On its own the current approach is all downsides and…

Nitpick: What I think you're talking about is not E2E because there is no recipient (ie in this scenario Apple is not able to decrypt your data). It's just bog-standard encryption so your files are private or only shared with people you choose.

We can only recognize the current situation, not a hypothetical future one.

I for one think it is unlikely that Apple will willingly lock themselves out of that mountain of intoxicating user data.

I believe their privacy stance is just marketing. There's countless examples of them not caring about real security issues, eg https://sneak.berlin/20201112/your-computer-isnt-yours/

Even if they do ever implement true encryption - not E2E between customer and Apple - personally I wouldn't trust it because of the unauditable on-device scanning/snitching.

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#326

Post by X6S1x6Okd1st »

testfoobar wrote: post #323
X6S1x6Okd1st wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Don't do vacation research, medical research, social media, Spotify, anything personal at all on your work device. Ever. That's quite extreme. What is your threat model?

Bright distinctions between work and personal devices make it easier to stay disciplined. Threat model is straightforward: I have no expectation of privacy on my work devices. I do not want my employer entangled digitally with my personal life.

That's not a threat model, that's a set of expectations and desires.

A threat model would be (albeit an absurd one):

I will be fired and blacklisted if an employer determines how many personal emails I send a day

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#327

Post by X6S1x6Okd1st »

blitzar wrote: post #280
X6S1x6Okd1st wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Don't do vacation research, medical research, social media, Spotify, anything personal at all on your work device. Ever. That's quite extreme. What is your threat model?

Is it really that extreme? Threat model, staying employed / defend against idle gossip. Company surveillance (of their employees) is very real and unlike 'google reads all my emails' they actually can and do and it is a person they actually know whos private information they are viewing. I dont even need to get into the chance of every piece of information being in a lawsuit or get into the lack of any controls aroun…

So your threat model is:

Extreme surveillance from your employer would unnerve you.

Your remediation is:

Firewall between work and personal.

Is that a reasonable restating?

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#329

Post by snowwrestler »

Terretta wrote: post #322
snowwrestler wrote: post #180

I feel like I might be crazy but… isn’t this an issue with Apple products at work in general? I am issued a MacBook Pro and iPhone from my employer. The IT dept. configured them to connect to our corporate infrastructure: Exchange, MS365, VPN, Dropbox, Slack, printers, etc. IT did not issue me a corporate iCloud account. I can add my personal iCloud account to these devices if I want, and then I’ll get all my music,…

Don’t add your personal iCloud account even if you want. Your goal is to not have to repurchase your music, apps, etc., but not commingle your personal photos and messages. You can do this with iCloud family child accounts. To use “your” stuff you paid for on a “work account” they ask you to set up using alternative email address, you can make the work account be a family child account. Then the work account can use…

This is a fantastic idea, thanks.

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#330

Post by Cd00d »

merrywhether wrote: post #228
xenophonf wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I find it freeing to be able to reply to a Slack or Outlook email while I'm with my kids at the playground. You can spend as much time on work as you want, but you only get so much time with your children. OP's point is that you should guard the time you have and spend it wisely. Personally, I find carrying a second device and keeping things separate part of maintaining a healthy balance between my work and my pers…

Part of the thought process is that he wouldn’t be at the playground with his kids in the middle of the day at all if it made him completely unavailable to respond to stuff. Similarly, I go surfing some mornings and respond to people on my watch to keep them unblocked while I’m having some fun at a time strict 9-5 wouldn’t allow.

This is exactly correct.
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