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Tesla AI Day [video]

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Re: Tesla AI Day [video]

#31

Post by TheJoeMan »

I might be completely wrong here, but hasn’t their collision incidents often been with weird things in the road such as sideways 18 wheelers and yellow lines heading into barricades? They’ve put lots of effort into tracking some pedestrian waaaaay over on the side passing behind trees, and that is really really impressive. But it seems to me the only reason it doesn’t hit a car in front on the road is because the neural net has tagged it as a “car”. I would like to see some system that also doesn’t collide into any sort of random object directly in front.

Along these lines, I read about the ditching of the radar, and I understand the technical limitations with the phantom stops under overpasses. But could someone help me understand why Teslas don’t just have the run of the mill Camry collision braking as a secondary measure independently?

Re: Tesla AI Day [video]

#32

Post by systemvoltage »

KETpXDDzR wrote: post #20
Invictus0 wrote: post #15

I like Andrej and I think he's a brilliant guy. At the end of the day though, there is no way for me or anyone to audit the neural networks or their training data. How can anyone trust them? I think this is really a fundamental problem with using neural networks in self-driving cars--I don't want to put my life in the hands of a fragile system that I, and no one alive, can understand. We are being asked to close our…

Compare it to a horse. No one knows what's going on in the horse's brain. However, we learned to trust it and how to deal with it safely. E.g., blinkers (the devices to limit a horse's peripheral view).

That’s an amazing analogy.

Re: Tesla AI Day [video]

#33

Post by [deleted] »

bpodgursky wrote: post #24
gccs wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"We trained a model, overfit on 1.4 trillion accident scenarios, and if behaved correctly on all of them."

Unless your model actually has trillions of parameters (and it doesn't, even gpt-3 only has 175 billion) it is not even possible to overfit on 1.4 trillion training inputs. You can't actually pigeonhole it.

[deleted]

Re: Tesla AI Day [video]

#34

Post by tru3_power »

ModernMech wrote: post #30
2bitencryption wrote: post #28

A big part of the presentation so far was an engineer describing the huge difficulty of stitching together the multiple cameras into one vector space that can be the input to the network, instead of treating each camera individually. Seems like the biggest problem was each pixel from a camera does not tell you how far away it is, so even if you know the camera is X feet off the grounding pointing at Y degrees, you do…

Yes. This is exactly what LIDAR is for. This is the reason every single team in the 2007 DARPA Urban challenge that finished the race was equipped with a Velodyne laser. We knew it was a critical enabling technology 14 years ago, and it baffles me Tesla is eschewing it. Tesla's lack of this technology is the main reason I feel they will never achieve what they claim to without a huge breakthrough in AI.

What was their reasoning for not using Lidar?

Re: Tesla AI Day [video]

#35

Post by Siecje »

tru3_power wrote: post #34
ModernMech wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. This is exactly what LIDAR is for. This is the reason every single team in the 2007 DARPA Urban challenge that finished the race was equipped with a Velodyne laser. We knew it was a critical enabling technology 14 years ago, and it baffles me Tesla is eschewing it. Tesla's lack of this technology is the main reason I feel they will never achieve what they claim to without a huge breakthrough in AI.

What was their reasoning for not using Lidar?

Cost and reliability.

But Elon says it is because they don't need it.

Re: Tesla AI Day [video]

#36

Post by rnaud »

tru3_power wrote: post #34
ModernMech wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. This is exactly what LIDAR is for. This is the reason every single team in the 2007 DARPA Urban challenge that finished the race was equipped with a Velodyne laser. We knew it was a critical enabling technology 14 years ago, and it baffles me Tesla is eschewing it. Tesla's lack of this technology is the main reason I feel they will never achieve what they claim to without a huge breakthrough in AI.

What was their reasoning for not using Lidar?

Too expensive + Your eyes already do the distance estimation and they are basically cameras so we can do this just as well or better.

Re: Tesla AI Day [video]

#37

Post by doctoboggan »

tru3_power wrote: post #34
ModernMech wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. This is exactly what LIDAR is for. This is the reason every single team in the 2007 DARPA Urban challenge that finished the race was equipped with a Velodyne laser. We knew it was a critical enabling technology 14 years ago, and it baffles me Tesla is eschewing it. Tesla's lack of this technology is the main reason I feel they will never achieve what they claim to without a huge breakthrough in AI.

What was their reasoning for not using Lidar?

I think originally it was because of the cost of the equipment. Elon and team saw how expensive lidar was and thought they needed to be able to solve the problem without it. However lidar has dropped drastically in price, so at this point I think they aren't using it just for ego reasons (i.e., we claimed it was possible to get self driving without lidar in the past, so we have to continue down that path)

Re: Tesla AI Day [video]

#38

Post by Aliabid94 »

tru3_power wrote: post #34
ModernMech wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. This is exactly what LIDAR is for. This is the reason every single team in the 2007 DARPA Urban challenge that finished the race was equipped with a Velodyne laser. We knew it was a critical enabling technology 14 years ago, and it baffles me Tesla is eschewing it. Tesla's lack of this technology is the main reason I feel they will never achieve what they claim to without a huge breakthrough in AI.

What was their reasoning for not using Lidar?

Too expensive. They also removed radar because of the global chip shortage so they're all in on vision.

Re: Tesla AI Day [video]

#39

Post by pcbro141 »

tru3_power wrote: post #34
ModernMech wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. This is exactly what LIDAR is for. This is the reason every single team in the 2007 DARPA Urban challenge that finished the race was equipped with a Velodyne laser. We knew it was a critical enabling technology 14 years ago, and it baffles me Tesla is eschewing it. Tesla's lack of this technology is the main reason I feel they will never achieve what they claim to without a huge breakthrough in AI.

What was their reasoning for not using Lidar?

Maybe the government's Autopilot probe will force them to change their mind on Lidar.

Re: Tesla AI Day [video]

#40

Post by twiceaday »

tru3_power wrote: post #34
ModernMech wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. This is exactly what LIDAR is for. This is the reason every single team in the 2007 DARPA Urban challenge that finished the race was equipped with a Velodyne laser. We knew it was a critical enabling technology 14 years ago, and it baffles me Tesla is eschewing it. Tesla's lack of this technology is the main reason I feel they will never achieve what they claim to without a huge breakthrough in AI.

What was their reasoning for not using Lidar?

I think Elon basically says that long term they will only need vision so they will spend all their time focusing on vision from the start. Maybe lidar will succeed first, but it will be a worse success than vision: redundant / expensive / intrusive.
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