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Apple now holding more cash than USA

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Apple now holding more cash than USA

#61

Post by jamesaguilar »

jdminhbg wrote: post #47
Bud wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Distributing profits via bonuses and dividends in the US without US taxes being collected on that money is bad, yes. It's not like corporations pay a very high tax rate, even on the rare occasions that they do actually pay their full tax obligation, after all. And the other point, of course, is that money that goes directly into the savings accounts of the already-rich does not tend to stimulate the economy very well…

> Distributing profits via bonuses and dividends in the US without US taxes being collected on that money is bad, yes. Since when are bonuses and dividends not taxed?

It doesn't count unless it's taxed at least three times.

Re: Apple now holding more cash than USA

#62

Post by onemoreact »

jdminhbg wrote: post #47
Bud wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Distributing profits via bonuses and dividends in the US without US taxes being collected on that money is bad, yes. It's not like corporations pay a very high tax rate, even on the rare occasions that they do actually pay their full tax obligation, after all. And the other point, of course, is that money that goes directly into the savings accounts of the already-rich does not tend to stimulate the economy very well…

> Distributing profits via bonuses and dividends in the US without US taxes being collected on that money is bad, yes. Since when are bonuses and dividends not taxed?

There are plenty of ways to set things up so that dividends are not taxed in the US, the most obvious being stocks owned by charitable organizations or resident of another country. As to bonuses the AMT was specifically created because of people paying zero taxes despite significant income. However, you can have situations where a bonus results in minimal, zero, or even negative additional taxes for a given year. EX: Putting the full value of a bonus into a 401k while over the SS cap.

Re: Apple now holding more cash than USA

#64

Post by xenophanes »

funthree wrote: post #57
ctdonath wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note that those big multinational corporations can't move money made outside the country to back home in the USA without incurring an absurd ~30% tax on top of whatever other taxes they paid whoever already. Word is Apple has been pushing for an amnesty so they _can_ bring their money home; until then, that money earned outside the US stays outside the US.

Maybe it's time they paid their fucking taxes like the rest of us.

IIRC, google pays like 4% taxes and apple like 25%.

Re: Apple now holding more cash than USA

#65

Post by bad_user »

dpark wrote: post #56
bad_user wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're wrong. As long as those money are flowing, it helps the economy. The only instance where it wouldn't is if it disappeared from the market. This is even more obvious in Europe where a large chunk of all taxes payed comes from VAT; which are like sales taxes in the U.S. except everybody pays them.

> As long as those money are flowing, it helps the economy. The only instance where it wouldn't is if it disappeared from the market. This is naive. In what sense does it help the economy if I take $1000 from my account and give it to my friend who puts it into his account? There's no extra money in circulation, no projects funded, no growth, nothing. Money moved and it did nothing. > This is even more obvious in Eur…

     if I take $1000 from my account and give it to my 
     friend who puts it into his account?
I am not really familiar with the U.S. but here's what happens in Europe, regardless of the legality of that transfer (in my country you cannot give 1000 USD as a gift and not pay taxes, unless you're using some kind of offshore account or other means of tax-evasion):

As soon as your friend spends it, in my country 240 USD will go to VAT. Out of the remaining sum, the company receiving the payment may have to pay salaries. Not even Google can get away with not paying taxes on salaries and taxes on salaries are somewhere north of 40%.

So lets say something like 450 USD (out of that 1000 USD) will end up in the pocket of some employee. Then that employee spends it on something -- another 100 USD will go to VAT, and ~ 340 USD going to the company receiving the payment. Some part of that 340 USD will go to salaries, which are taxed and then employees are buying stuff, so they get taxed again.

Companies also pay taxes on investments or sunken costs, not only salaries. So if Apple brings home some of those billions, but acquires some U.S. company, than a lot of money will still go as taxes.

It really goes round and round.

Also, here's an anecdote -- I live in Romania. We are not like Greece, we are not currently in danger of defaulting. Do you know the main reason for that? It's not because we pay our taxes -- in fact, I think we do more tax evasion than Greece is.

The reason has to do with money getting in. We've got more than 4 million people with foreign jobs and residences that are sending money home to their families. Those money are not getting taxed, but it has been enough for our economy to not completely go downhill, and I know this little fact from good sources.

Re: Apple now holding more cash than USA

#66

Post by fourspace »

JacobAldridge wrote: post #30
fourspace wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, they want spending to be less than or equal to revenues. That's the only rational way to run a business.

"That's the only rational way to run a business." Actually, it's not - ask any business that's taken funding, borrowed to invest, or even run an overdraft as part of their low season. Spending less than or equal to revenues is one way to run a business, especially a small business that you only intend to grow incrementally (if at all). Borrowing to invest for faster growth is a very rational way to run a business in…

To clarify, I meant over the long term. If you're not making profits or at least breaking even over the long term (spending The problem with the US is that they aren't just borrowing in a low season, they're borrowing every season.

Re: Apple now holding more cash than USA

#68

Post by thematt »

funthree wrote: post #57
ctdonath wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note that those big multinational corporations can't move money made outside the country to back home in the USA without incurring an absurd ~30% tax on top of whatever other taxes they paid whoever already. Word is Apple has been pushing for an amnesty so they _can_ bring their money home; until then, that money earned outside the US stays outside the US.

Maybe it's time they paid their fucking taxes like the rest of us.

Why should they pay tax on that money? It was generated in a foreign country by a foreign corporation and already subjected to foreign taxes.

The US didn't expend resources helping them make that money, therefore it doesn't deserve any of it. If anything, we should be encouraging them to bring it back here.

Re: Apple now holding more cash than USA

#70

Post by xenophanes »

Natsu wrote: post #67
xenophanes wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IIRC, google pays like 4% taxes and apple like 25%.

Do you have a source on that?

http://www.advfn.com/p.php?pid=financials&symbol=NASDAQ%...

24.4% for apple

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-10-21/google-2-4-rate-sho...

2.4% for google

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