There's a lot of css issues on mobile on imba.io
Yep, I'm on mobile and the website doesn't really give me much confidence in how Imba works with responsive development
Show HN: Imba – I have spent 7 years creating a programming language for the web
161–170 of 354 posts
Re: Show HN: Imba – I have spent 7 years creating a programming language for the web
#162Looks cool. I'm honestly curious as to why a lot of new web languages/frameworks are mixing logic and content in the same file again though. The distinction between HTML, JS and CSS always made perfect sense to me. Anyone care to enlighten me?
This is exactly why I prefer Angular to React. Our designer wouldn't have been able to deal with HTML markup within the JS files in React. Having the HTML and (S)CSS separated out made life much easier for him in Angular. (edit: Naturally downvoted due to being slightly critical of React on HN. Which happens every time.)
React is garbage I have no idea why it took off. Angular all day e'ry day.
Re: Show HN: Imba – I have spent 7 years creating a programming language for the web
#163Looks cool. I'm honestly curious as to why a lot of new web languages/frameworks are mixing logic and content in the same file again though. The distinction between HTML, JS and CSS always made perfect sense to me. Anyone care to enlighten me?
I think eventually everyone just realized that so much of the styling is dependent on the element hierarchy that makes up the page that it’s pointless (and indeed painful) to separate your HTML from the component that uses it. If you are actually using components, that isn’t much of an issue. In a time when you’d be returning a whole document every single time, it might make sense to say ‘style this one document with…
This! Usually CSS doesn't even make sense outside the context of the page/component it's styling.
There's also some nice stuff with modern tooling, where CSS is global by nature but writing it with your JS allows for the platform to automatically namespace your CSS, making styling behavior much more consistent.
Separately it also often makes sense to style things not just based on the HTML produced but also based on data stored in JS; writing your CSS with your components allows for a greater level of dynamic styles (which, to be fair, if you can achieve with pure static CSS is preferable, but it's not always the case).
Re: Show HN: Imba – I have spent 7 years creating a programming language for the web
#164I just want to compliment the OP on a very clear and comprehensive website at https://imba.io/ . It clearly explains (by showing and telling) what Imba is, why I should care, how it works and how to get started. The floating demo applications even work well on mobile. Rare to see this level of polish for these things.
One thing that site does not specify is the Imba's license (MIT)
Re: Show HN: Imba – I have spent 7 years creating a programming language for the web
#165Looks cool. I'm honestly curious as to why a lot of new web languages/frameworks are mixing logic and content in the same file again though. The distinction between HTML, JS and CSS always made perfect sense to me. Anyone care to enlighten me?
Personally I've always been kind of confused by the common best practice of separating everything. React and Vue single file components made so much sense to me. I guess if I were to rationalize my position, I'd say it's because I have a hard time finding related things when they're separate. If a button or "a" tag have a special click handler, I want to know when looking at it. If it just has classes, then I don't k…
Personally I think it's not so much about separation of concerns/technologies per se, it's that this debate boils down to a different debate under the hood: the one about folder-by-type vs folder-by-feature[0].
The gist is that folder-by-feature is generally preferrable because it requires less context switching (in the literal sense of jumping between multiple different far away folders and scanning each for the thing you're looking for)
Single file components force you to organize code in a folder-by-feature structure, to a large extent. You can use folder-by-feature structure alongside with separation of technologies, it's just not that common to see it because the tooling to support it is not quite as optimized.
[0] https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/3385...
Re: Show HN: Imba – I have spent 7 years creating a programming language for the web
#166I just want to compliment the OP on a very clear and comprehensive website at https://imba.io/ . It clearly explains (by showing and telling) what Imba is, why I should care, how it works and how to get started. The floating demo applications even work well on mobile. Rare to see this level of polish for these things.
Exact opposite of Elastic.co.
Re: Show HN: Imba – I have spent 7 years creating a programming language for the web
#167i wouldnt call it a language, it basically asks u to install nodejs, which is the actual language itself. U do however have a custom syntax, but i find your project much more like a web framework. Personally i would add strict typing. But that's just me i guess :)
Re: Show HN: Imba – I have spent 7 years creating a programming language for the web
#168Looks cool. I'm honestly curious as to why a lot of new web languages/frameworks are mixing logic and content in the same file again though. The distinction between HTML, JS and CSS always made perfect sense to me. Anyone care to enlighten me?
(Disclaimer not a web but backend dev.)
In my experience it's much more important to modularize/capsulate/segmentate by groupings of business logic then by groupings of implementation details.
Applying this to web applications (not simple text focused websites) this would mean that its preferable to have everything (HTML+JS+CSS) related to a specific widget (e.g. counter) in one place, instead of splitting it into many parts sprinkled across many files potentially in different folders. Similarly you also would e.g. want the CSS to be encapsulated as to the component as far as possible.
Its a bit of a different matter for classical html documents where the HTML made sense without JS or CSS and both where thinks you added "on top" to "just make it a bit nicer" but this isn't the think anymore for modern webapps (and many fancy websites).
Also if you work in a situation where you have many huge teams working on the same UI at the same time touching the same logical component (but normally different aspects of it) then having a more clear segregation can also make sense, but >99% of all companies are not ever in that situation.
This is also for example a major critic I have with react, it splits one logical unit across different files making it much harder to reason about it for the benefit of adding a bit more decoupling which isn't needed by >99% of dev teams.
Re: Show HN: Imba – I have spent 7 years creating a programming language for the web
#169Earlier quoted context omitted.
The pragmatic answer is that, for the the large companies usually behind those frameworks, they can have many independent teams that are working on split components, without marching on each other's toes. But to me, there's a parallel to be made between both the newer trends of components and micro-services, and the old idea of Object Oriented Programming. In all cases, you get sold on the idea that everything should…
I agree. The real difficulty in software engineering is at the seams where systems or components have to interact with other systems/components. The more seams, the more difficulty. The key though is that componentization is useful when you find yourself writing the same code over and over again. That's where DRY steps in and says yeah this should be its own component. This is one reason monoliths are great as an app…
Yep, the way I see it is, how much abstraction are you willing to accept.
Intuitively you may not want too much, until you find out that maybe you could have needed a bit more because of the repetitiveness. So frameworks that give you the option to gradually increase it when you need are the best. And when the documentation follows those patterns it's really great (I'd put Vue in that category).
Usually the thinking was, while it may not make sense, it will someday when my project grows, so let's adopt it right away. And for years I would have said that was a decent advice. Nowadays I think that with some of the more extreme scales behind some of those trends though, it's not always as clear cut.
Re: Show HN: Imba – I have spent 7 years creating a programming language for the web
#170Very cool, good luck! I'm sure you'll do great
p.s. if you would be open to listing your positions on a 4 day work week (even at 80% salary) I'd be more than happy to promote them on https://4dayweek.io + the newsletter for free