51–60 of 356 posts
> “We were all following orders, we were all victims of the same machine,” he says.
Echoes of Nelson Mandela.
Among the key figures in the design of American torture programs during the War on Terror were American psychologists James Elmer Mitchell ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Elmer_Mitchell ) and Bruce Jessen ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruce_Jessen ), who were paid $81m for their work. Irony upon ironies: "Mitchell, who is retired and lives in Land o' Lakes, Florida, spends his free time kayaking, rafting and…
Amnesty International answered him: https://www.amnestyusa.org/press-releases/amnesty-responds-t...
Key figures in US military and US leadership need to be held accountable. Same as with CEOs, if you only punish the organization and not specifically the leaders, there is no disincentive to doing it again. Clearly the US is exempt from the war crimes laws, and that needs to change. But it would require leaders of other major powers/countries to push for this. But… this will never happen because almost no leader want…
Isn't that a bit of a one-sided, vindictive point of view? I don't know who are still being detained in Guantánamo, but if there are terrorists among them, shouldn't these key figures then also be rewarded?
I don't have the answer neither, but IMO the way the responsible people should be treated depends on their intentions, willingness to accept suffering of innocents, external limitations on their powers, and the net effect of their actions, not only on a seemingly simple case of wrongdoing.
Trump wasn't the worst US President. Bush2 was. And he is still a guest at late-night TV shows. Incredible.
Among the key figures in the design of American torture programs during the War on Terror were American psychologists James Elmer Mitchell ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Elmer_Mitchell ) and Bruce Jessen ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruce_Jessen ), who were paid $81m for their work. Irony upon ironies: "Mitchell, who is retired and lives in Land o' Lakes, Florida, spends his free time kayaking, rafting and…
> He describes himself as an atheist and a supporter of Amnesty International That's a funny one. Someone should interview him and see how he sees himself and his role, and does he consider himself to be a war criminal.
Sacha Baron Cohen. Seriously, Sacha's interview with Dick Cheney where he asked him to sign his waterboarding kit was pure gold: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DmUnUoeLSIM
What the US is doing to Assange at the moment is a war crime in itself.
These kinds of comments detract from the horror of the crimes in Guantanamo. It reminds me a bit of when Americans opposed to mask mandates liken them to having to wear yellow Stars of David. Guantanamo detainees were tortured with stress positions, sexual abuse (including simulated rape), simulated executions (including being taken out to sea and told they would be thrown overboard), held in cold rooms, and told the…
[1] https://www.ohchr.org/en/NewsEvents/Pages/DisplayNews.aspx?N...
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Clearly the US is exempt from the war crimes laws, and that needs to change. The US is not exempt from laws relating to war crimes. While it is not a member of the ICC, it is bound to the laws of war as is any other state.
That’s an obvious lie. US is extremely loyal to its war criminals - good example is how people responsible for downing Iran Air Flight 655 not only never got punished, but were actually decorated. Even Russia handles this kind of situations better.
Yeah?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaysia_Airlines_Flight_17#Br...
Key figures in US military and US leadership need to be held accountable. Same as with CEOs, if you only punish the organization and not specifically the leaders, there is no disincentive to doing it again. Clearly the US is exempt from the war crimes laws, and that needs to change. But it would require leaders of other major powers/countries to push for this. But… this will never happen because almost no leader want…
> Clearly the US is exempt from the war crimes laws, and that needs to change. But it would require leaders of other major powers/countries to push for this I don't see this happening any time soon, without a popular movement that drastically alters the American political landscape. Whichever party a president and legislators are from, they have war criminals among their ranks, so they couldn't accept their friends,…
I agree that proportional representation and greater democracy can fix a lot of current problems, but we don't need to put off everything until that arrives and indeed that will need to be achieved within the current system and might need similar compromises to be achieved.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think it provides a worthwhile perspective as to the motivations of the US and what actions it considers to be important enough to put non-trivial effort and resources towards the pursuit and punishment of. ie. Not the doing of the things, but the public revelation of the doing of the things. I think it's entirely pertinent to the discussion.
> I think it provides a worthwhile perspective as to the motivations of the US and what actions it considers to be important enough to put non-trivial effort and resources towards the pursuit and punishment of. "The US" is not a monolith. Guantanamo--both the rapid expansion and ingestion of likely-innocent bystanders and the torture program--was an effort of the Bush-era Defense Department, specifically with high-le…
The biggest change I've seen in the last 20 years is the recent (sudden?) withdrawal of troops from Afghanistan.
To be clear, I don't think you're wrong, I think we're just coming in at different angles of subjectivity, and the above is just how I see it from where I am.
Key figures in US military and US leadership need to be held accountable. Same as with CEOs, if you only punish the organization and not specifically the leaders, there is no disincentive to doing it again. Clearly the US is exempt from the war crimes laws, and that needs to change. But it would require leaders of other major powers/countries to push for this. But… this will never happen because almost no leader want…
> Key figures in US military and US leadership need to be held accountable. Isn't that a bit of a one-sided, vindictive point of view? I don't know who are still being detained in Guantánamo, but if there are terrorists among them, shouldn't these key figures then also be rewarded? I don't have the answer neither, but IMO the way the responsible people should be treated depends on their intentions, willingness to acc…
Compare: Throw the whole population of your country in prison. Clearly, you've also imprisoned every terrorist of your country. Should you be rewarded for that?
The Guantanamo situation is comparable: The US picked random people from the street based on gossip at best, or because they looked funny at a soldier at worst, and threw them in jail and tortured them. No process, no nothing. Nobody should be rewarded for that.