Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires • Hacker News Board

Re: Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires

#241

Post by david927 » Sat, Aug 14, 2021, 3:10 PM UTC

simonh wrote: post #230

david927 wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> [The billionaires] job is creating companies, jobs, products and services not ending poverty They're being asked to pay their fair share of taxes and instead are using their wealth to find loopholes so that they pay nothing. The US has regressive taxation. > Too many Marxists on the left... I'm not sure that there really are any Marxists on the left and that's certainly not what's holding back addressing poverty. N…

Ok, appreciated. I have to say, I’m not entirely convinced by the growing wealth gap argument. Pickety’s numbers are all before taxes and transfers, there are huge holes in the analysis. On the other hand, there are too many renty ways to grow wealth. I believe the right approach is to recalibrate taxation and the incentive system, not just slap huge punitive taxes on top of what’s already there.

I think everyone would be in favor of well-considered approaches, myself included. But we need to be actively discussing this with a sense of urgency.

Re: Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires

#242

Post by Geee » Sat, Aug 14, 2021, 9:30 PM UTC

lamontcg wrote: post #237

Geee wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is because every good investment causes deflation, which in other words is increased economic efficiency. Capital must be misallocated in order to create inflation. It's a huge misconception that inflation is good for the economy. What actually happens, is that the economy on the whole gets more inefficient and wealth concentrates.

Inflation does not cause wealth concentration. Inflation acts as a tax on hoarding money and reduces wealth concentration.

Wealthy don't hoard money. They hoard assets which appreciate with inflation, and they can get cheap debt against their assets. Inflation affects the poor the most, because their net worth is in cash, and they are dependent on their wage which doesn't increase hand in hand with asset prices.

Re: Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires

#243

Post by holograham » Sat, Aug 14, 2021, 11:32 PM UTC

throw0101a wrote: post #234

dcolkitt wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only 7% of surveyed top economists disagreed with the statement that a wealth tax would be much more difficult to enforce than the existing tax code. https://www.igmchicago.org/surveys/wealth-taxes/

> We invited our US panel to express their views on three separate issues related to the wealth tax: […] And how was the criteria for this panel chosen? What would a random sampling of, say, NBER affiliated scholars give? Given previous surveys from Chicago Booth were done, it seems that there's an ideological slant to those they ask for advice: * https://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/01/05/ideology-and-ec... Furthe…

dont know anything about the economics panel/survey but citing Krugman on HN is pretty weak given his most infamous quote:

"The Internet's effect on the economy is no greater than the fax machine's.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/paul-krugman-internets-eff...

Re: Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires

#244

Post by EarlKing » Sun, Aug 15, 2021, 9:32 AM UTC

V-eHGsd_ wrote: post #235

EarlKing wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...a wealth transfer to Moderna. There. Saved everyone a read.

wait, is "covid is a ploy to transfer wealth to the companies providing a vaccine against the greatest global pandemic in a century" an actual anti-vax talking point? I guess I shouldn't be surprised.

Vaccines do not pay for themselves. The proposed tax is literally about paying for the vaccines. So you're literally talking about giving out corporate welfare. Want to silence this talking point? Abandon the effort to tax people to pay for the vaccine and obtain them purely at-cost so Moderna, et al. are unable to use "the greatest global pandemic in a century" to make a mint. I mean, if this is really about getting the vaccine out then you should have no problem backing a proposal like that... RIGHT?

Re: Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires

#245

Post by IgorPartola » Sun, Aug 15, 2021, 1:12 PM UTC

jppope wrote: post #219

IgorPartola wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Citation needed.

Note: This was 5min of google search and reading abstracts/ overviews. Unfortunately I can't commit the amount of time necessary to provide a full rebuttal right now. From Representatives: - https://posey.house.gov/wasteful-spending/ - https://www.paul.senate.gov/wastereport - https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/CHRG-114shrg95798/html/CHRG-114shrg95798.htm From the Media: - https://www.rd.com/list/wasteful-government…

Right. Waste happens in the government. None of this compares it to how wasteful an oligarchy would be, which was the original comparison.

Re: Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires

#246

Post by IgorPartola » Sun, Aug 15, 2021, 1:15 PM UTC

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #195

IgorPartola wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure. But here is the thing: what consequences to billionaires face if they use their wealth in stupid and unproductive ways? At least for the government we have some recourse (elections, protests, public hearings).

But to the degree that the reason for doing this is "the rich shouldn't have that much money", to that degree there's no pressure on the government to use the money wisely. And I don't like your question. Sure, billionaires can use their wealth badly. Why should they face consequences (other than no longer having what they have wasted)? That someone could misuse something is not a reason to take it from them and give…

The original proposition was that essentially an oligarchy is more efficient than our current system: billionaires will waste less money than the government on inefficiencies. In that light I don’t mean consequences as punishment but rather incentive. Why should a billionaire spend money on socially useful project vs a self-serving or a socially harmful one?