Live data from Hacker News

Aspartame and cancer – new evidence for causation

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

121–130 of 315 posts

Re: Aspartame and cancer – new evidence for causation

#121
post #45

Aspartame isn't just widely consumed, it's practically universally consumed. If it was carcinogenic in humans, wouldn't there be obvious epidemiological evidence to back that up?

Well, cancer is a leading cause of death so it may not be easy to tease that one out.

Regardless, where did you get the idea it's "practically universally" consumed?

Taking soda for example, people typically either do or don't drink diet soda, and in much of the beverage chillers I've seen "diet" is stocked in the minority (with limited regional variation). Bear in mind diet itself is fractured into aspartame and stevia and various others.

Similarly, aspartame or sorbitol or other artificial sweeteners are presented as an option for most hot drinks, alongside sugar - in my experience it's the sugar constantly being replaced on the table.

Looking at packaged foods, I can find few products containing it, and again, packaged foods are only a subsection of all foods out there.

Also there are those among us who consume predominantly (in many cases only) fresh vegetables, fruit, grains, legumes etc.

Look at India, China, Africa, and everywhere in between - this is well over half the worlds population and while many are exposed to at least a small selection of packaged foods, few can afford them, and many simply have no interest.

Just a cursory glance and very rough estimate showed 6000 metric tonnes of Nutrasweet produced in 2014. Divided into a population of 7.8 billion gives each person less than a gram per year.

Aside from the fact that like all products a chunk of that will go back to landfill unsold, there simply isn't nearly enough for it to be universally consumed.

Re: Aspartame and cancer – new evidence for causation

#122
post #23
post #4

Note that it is in rodent. Aspartame hadn't been confirmed as a carcinogenic agent in humans. That said, I don't think it's a good idea to subject to ourselves to drinking diet soda as a daily habit. It costs money, may or may not interfere with your blood sugar and the health of your gut microbiomes. As a goal, I limit my intake of any sweet and/or artifically sweetened drinks. Instead of being a chronic diet coke d…

Considering how widespread Aspartame on a societal level, you'd think there'd be epidemiologic evidence of increasing cancer rates over that time. Maybe there is some literature on it, but I hadn't heard.

There seems to be an increase of people with a range of neurodevelopmental conditions like repetitive patterns of behavior and a perturbed sense of identity.

Re: Aspartame and cancer – new evidence for causation

#123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Artificial sweeteners still make you crave sweets. How do you know that this is true?

I think there is evidence that this is true for some sweeteners, such as Ace K, but I don't think this is the case with aspartame.

Anecdotally people who do keto have documented increased insulin levels from artificial sweeteners.

Re: Aspartame and cancer – new evidence for causation

#124
post #111
post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"While PTFE is stable and nontoxic at lower temperatures, it begins to deteriorate after the temperature of cookware reaches about 260 °C (500 °F), and decomposes above 350 °C (662 °F).[58] Over 400 °C (752 °F) pyrolysis occurs and more decomposition becomes significantly more rapid. The main decomposition products are tetrafluoroethylene (TFE) and difluorocarbene radicals (RCF2).[58] The degradation by-products can…

> However these cases of polymer fume fever were mostly present in people who had cooked at 390 °C (734 °F) for ≥4 hours. My oven goes up to 250 °C, though I never use it above 220. What cooking processes go to each of these thresholds?

Frying.

Re: Aspartame and cancer – new evidence for causation

#125
post #111
post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"While PTFE is stable and nontoxic at lower temperatures, it begins to deteriorate after the temperature of cookware reaches about 260 °C (500 °F), and decomposes above 350 °C (662 °F).[58] Over 400 °C (752 °F) pyrolysis occurs and more decomposition becomes significantly more rapid. The main decomposition products are tetrafluoroethylene (TFE) and difluorocarbene radicals (RCF2).[58] The degradation by-products can…

> However these cases of polymer fume fever were mostly present in people who had cooked at 390 °C (734 °F) for ≥4 hours. My oven goes up to 250 °C, though I never use it above 220. What cooking processes go to each of these thresholds?

A broiler typically goes to or above 260°C. A pizza oven can pretty easily get above 400°C.

Not sure why anyone would use nonstick cookware in a pizza oven, but people make bad decisions frequently enough.

Re: Aspartame and cancer – new evidence for causation

#126
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, yes, replace 'sweets' with 'fruits' which are about 50-75% sugar by non-water mass. Eg strawberries - 100 g is 7.7g of carbohydrates (4.9g sugar), 0.7g protein, 0.3g fat. 56% sugar. Or oranges - 165 g without membrane or peel is 20.7g carbs (14g sugar), 1.5g protein, 0.2g fat. 63% sugar. As opposed to, say, a snickers bar. 9.1g carbohydrates (7.6g sugar), 1.1g protein, 3.6g fat. 55% sugar. Or a kitkat. 27.1g carb…

Everyone says this but it misses the point. Fruit in it's natural state is a complete package of nutrients, fiber, and unrefined sugar. It has less of an impact on blood sugar than processed food with the same amount of sugar.

Why? Why is “processed” automatically bad?

Re: Aspartame and cancer – new evidence for causation

#127
To the fruit issue, it needs to be said that fructose can only be metabolized or stored in the liver, the capacity is about 25 grams for an adult, that would be one banana. Or two apples. It's not bad, but should be kept in mind. The same vitamins can are in vegetables, but of course veggies do not taste as good.

Re: Aspartame and cancer – new evidence for causation

#128
post #45

Aspartame isn't just widely consumed, it's practically universally consumed. If it was carcinogenic in humans, wouldn't there be obvious epidemiological evidence to back that up?

Well, cancer is a leading cause of death so it may not be easy to tease that one out. Regardless, where did you get the idea it's "practically universally" consumed? Taking soda for example, people typically either do or don't drink diet soda, and in much of the beverage chillers I've seen "diet" is stocked in the minority (with limited regional variation). Bear in mind diet itself is fractured into aspartame and ste…

People keep saying that it's hard to tease this out of the data, but consumption of aspartame skyrocketed suddenly in the 1980s. We ran the natural experiment. We have the before-after data. Does that data show a sharp rise in cancer correlated to aspartame consumption? No, it does not; it shows in fact (I believe) the opposite.

That's the argument I'm inviting you to rebut. There are ways to rebut it! But "the data is super subtle" is on its own not a powerful argument.

Re: Aspartame and cancer – new evidence for causation

#129
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, yes, replace 'sweets' with 'fruits' which are about 50-75% sugar by non-water mass. Eg strawberries - 100 g is 7.7g of carbohydrates (4.9g sugar), 0.7g protein, 0.3g fat. 56% sugar. Or oranges - 165 g without membrane or peel is 20.7g carbs (14g sugar), 1.5g protein, 0.2g fat. 63% sugar. As opposed to, say, a snickers bar. 9.1g carbohydrates (7.6g sugar), 1.1g protein, 3.6g fat. 55% sugar. Or a kitkat. 27.1g carb…

I think the issue isn't just the pure carb content. 100g of strawberries is a lot of strawberries. 100 g of Snickers bars is... two bars. I can easily eat two and then crave another one right away. After 100 g of strawberries, I'm pretty much done for a while. Same with say, apples. I think one thing that is usually overlooked in these discussions is the "feeling" part of it, for lack of a better term. Some things ma…

> make you want to keep on eating

Junk food recipes are a/b tested and statistically evaluated just like in ad tech.

Re: Aspartame and cancer – new evidence for causation

#130
post #4

Note that it is in rodent. Aspartame hadn't been confirmed as a carcinogenic agent in humans. That said, I don't think it's a good idea to subject to ourselves to drinking diet soda as a daily habit. It costs money, may or may not interfere with your blood sugar and the health of your gut microbiomes. As a goal, I limit my intake of any sweet and/or artifically sweetened drinks. Instead of being a chronic diet coke d…

Best too drink water atleast 30 minutes before or after the meal because it dilutes the stomach digestive acids
Post reply on HN