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It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

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Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#511
post #495
post #372

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"This site is sadly run by militant commies who are triggered by the existence of better men." I lol'd at this part from your profile. I mean, you believe this and are literally trolling right now. This should be flagged.

Most of my posts get flagged. Not trolling, but I could see how it would seem that way to the extremely confused.

Yeah but you are[1].

"In internet slang, a troll is a person who posts inflammatory, insincere, digressive, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community ... with the intent of provoking readers into displaying emotional responses, or manipulating others' perception. "

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll

HN isn't Reddit. Stop.

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#512
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is it is difficult to solve the issue with the coal powered plants when huge segments of the population are fine with "rolling coal" and think it's good to dump on EVs and green policy in general.

So the answer is to get raged at Rolling coal and that’ll change their minds?

I did not intend to suggest that. My point is that without changing folks opinions greater change is not possible - and a large number of people do not think climate change is something important to combat.

Getting mad at coal plants won't help either, it will just give that segment of the population something to rally behind (coal power).

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#513

Imagine an asteroid would be on trajectory to collide with earth in (say) 2025. Possible order of hypothetical events: 1. Scientist discover the asteroid. Calculate risk of collision. 2. Asteroid comes closer, probability of impact is calculated as high. 3. People will start saying that we cannot let our economy be controlled by the specter of an asteroid. 4. The asteroid becomes visible. You can see it with your bar…

Honestly, given our track record I don't understand how we've actually managed to ban fluorocarbons globally.

That was a decade ago when there was no real way for the loony opposition to come together.

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#514
post #341

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is nonsense. Whether someone virtue signals or not, actions are what's important, not words. The CO2 emissions output has been coming down since the high in 2006. With the old boss and the new boss. https://www.statista.com/statistics/183943/us-carbon-dioxide... If anything, fracking helped the environment, since it offset resources being mined by the traditional, more wasteful methods.

> If anything, fracking helped the environment Maybe fracking helped reduce emissions for now, but it remains to be seen whether it helped the environment. It could take decades to learn about all the negative impacts it has.

You are right. That's what I meant to say.

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#515
post #8

Who still believes global warming does not exist? I am currently listening to audiobook of Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six (1998). It has a paragraph on global warming and trying to convince POTUS it is real. And POTUS not wanting to act on it because it would be too large economic drag on US. This book is almost quarter of century old.

Plenty of comments in this thread claiming it's real but not that big a deal

Unreal

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#516
post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

50 million years ago, there were forests in the arctic and the earth was much hotter than it is right now. Climate change comes in both man-made and natural varieties, and it's important to acknowledge the difference. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eocene

Also we have built a very large amount of infrastructure that assumes the climate is the way it is now. You think it's expensive and annoying to have software dependencies pushed to you when you aren't ready, try being forced to take SeaLevel 2.0 and HurricaneFrequency 10 before you are ready.

I think this is the main takeaway. If we lived on earth 50 million years ago when there were no ice caps, we would still thrive. But we would be living vey differently, in different areas, and dependent on different ecosystems. Such sudden change is the problem.

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#517

Imagine an asteroid would be on trajectory to collide with earth in (say) 2025. Possible order of hypothetical events: 1. Scientist discover the asteroid. Calculate risk of collision. 2. Asteroid comes closer, probability of impact is calculated as high. 3. People will start saying that we cannot let our economy be controlled by the specter of an asteroid. 4. The asteroid becomes visible. You can see it with your bar…

The challenge with this analogy is that the rich countries could unilaterally solve this asteroid problem. If that was true for global warming, I think we might have a chance, but not only isn't it true, the rich countries don't even _matter_ at this point.

(Yes, they matter _per capita_ but that's a fairness discussion not a capability discussion.)

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#518

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a severely underestimated group of religious people who think that only God controls the weather, His reasons for what he does with it are not for you to evaluate, and that saying that humans can change the weather is blasphemy. It's easy to make fun of, but the most direct experience that people have of a God who controls the universe would be the weather. These people need to be approached theologically; s…

I have never been able to get my head around the religious paradox of God has a plan and free will. Can we make choices that effect the outcome of things or is it all part of Gods plan? It can't be both right? Did God create everything including free will or does it exist outside of his control? I don't blame my program when it does something wrong, I mean I wrote the code that tells it how to behave.

So, the book of Job. Paraphrasing.

God and Satan are sitting together in Heaven. God says "Look at my servant Job, he loves me so much, he does his sacrifices, he worships me constantly." Satan says "Of course he does, you spoiled him rotten with children and riches and stuff. I bet if you kick him in the teeth a few times he'll turn on you, because that's how humans are."

They have a bet. No stakes, mind you, just a gentleman's wager. Satan destroys Job's life. Plagues, famine, all of his children dead. He's a caricature of misery, wallowing in sorrow, rags soaked in pus and bitter tears. He can't figure it out. He's lived his entire life as a righteous man, blessed by God, then one day God just kicked him in the teeth.

Eventually God shows up. Verse 38 (https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Job%2038&versio...) God spends the entire chapter answering, in essence, "I'm God. Who are you to question me?" An interesting part of this chapter is that, if one takes it seriously, it strongly implies that God is in direct control over everything - no free will, no randomness.

Romans 9:19-24 is also interesting, spelling out in no uncertain terms that, yes, God does predetermine everything, including moral choice. And he punishes the sinful, despite making them sinful.

  "One of you will say to me: “Then why does God still blame us? For who is able to resist his will?” 20 But who are you, a human being, to talk back to God? “Shall what is formed say to the one who formed it, ‘Why did you make me like this?’”[a] 21 Does not the potter have the right to make out of the same lump of clay some pottery for special purposes and some for common use?"

  "22 What if God, although choosing to show his wrath and make his power known, bore with great patience the objects of his wrath—prepared for destruction? 23 What if he did this to make the riches of his glory known to the objects of his mercy, whom he prepared in advance for glory— 24 even us, whom he also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles?"
Again, the answer isn't that God is perfectly just, or perfectly loving, but simply that God has the right to do what he will with his possessions. God will kick a righteous man in the teeth on a dare if he wants to. Pray harder n00b.

The problem is the Abrahamic canon is so old that parts of it predate Judaic monotheism (see parts of Genesis referring to God or the council of Gods in the plural, or the commandment "thou shalt not have any gods before me.") The image of God and his nature evolves with religion and society, and eventually God's nature contradicts itself. Modern Christians have to reconcile their morality with the parts of the Bible that openly condone slavery and genocide, and Paul's sexist BS. Why would an all loving, all benevolent Father talk about dashing infants against rocks and sending rape gangs against his enemies?

Because 4000 or so years ago, back when people collected the foreskins of their enemies in jars as wedding gifts, that's exactly what one would expect of a just God.

Don't bother trying to square the circle. The Bible isn't a singular coherent narrative planned out from beginning to end, it's thousands of years of poetry, prose, legal documents, mythology and insane fever dream, and it contradicts itself in many, many places. If you approach it not as a divinely inspired book spelling out the absolute, immutable truth about who GOD is, but as an account of generations of people trying to reconcile their belief in the divine with reality, and coming to radically different conclusions, then the paradox resolves itself.

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#519

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My (albeit atheist looking in, but with a Christian upbringing) understanding of that is it's sort of like how classical physics comes out of the randomness of quantum physics. You have free will, that absolutely can affect the world, but god's plan is emergent in a way that takes into account the randomness of free will, combined with occasionally putting this thumb on the scale with saints, miracles, etc. In that s…

That would seem to require an outside source of entropy to drive the randomness who created that and where does it come from?

Keeping with the metaphor, I'm not sure that quantum entropy requires an additional source of randomness, only the classic concept of entropy. The thermodynamic laws like that are a emergent projection of the quantum realm and don't always have a distinct analog. Additionally, one could argue a breakdown of the metaphor, that randomness isn't a complete analog for free will, and is only useful for talking about free will in aggregate where the different choices tend to cancel and coalesce.

And, again, none of this is a position I actually hold, just where I've ended up trying to understand the cognitive framework of people vastly different from my own who simply have different axioms they start with.

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#520
post #8

Who still believes global warming does not exist? I am currently listening to audiobook of Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six (1998). It has a paragraph on global warming and trying to convince POTUS it is real. And POTUS not wanting to act on it because it would be too large economic drag on US. This book is almost quarter of century old.

I don't personally know any reasonably intelligent people who question the existence of global warming.

I do, however, know several highly intelligent people who have looked at the atmospheric carbon and temperature data and wonder (quietly, for obvious reasons) if we might have got the causal mechanism story wrong.

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