It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record • Hacker News Board

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#311

Post by spapas82 » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 7:28 PM UTC

lmilcin wrote: post #238

spapas82 wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

About this, what was very puzzling to me was the opinions of the late Michael Chrichton. He was constantly expressing the opinion that the global warming was a frame up, both in his books but also to various talks. He had even written a book on which the bad guys were Greenpeace agents! Now, considering how highly educated (not only he was a great author but he also had studied MD) and smart (this should be obvious t…

For almost every issue you can find at least one highly educated person that thinks otherwise. If you think something is "controversial" because one person thinks otherwise, we would never land at anything. Look at their arguments and proofs. If you don't have time to examine those, look at their credentials and motivations. Michael Chrichton was a writer and filmmaker. Not a climate resarcher.

Yes I understand this, the current covid situation has taught us that scientists don't always agree, especially when the answer isn't a universal truth. However, for the covid (or for example that smoke causes cancer debate) each scientific camp has some agenda and things to gain (either economically or scientifically or even as a matter of personal pride). The thing with Chrichton is that (as you say and I agree) was that he was an outsider to this field. And he knew that his opinions would be considered controversial and won't be liked by many people. But still made them public, along with a lot of data to support his claims. This behaviour is puzzling to me.

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#312

Post by ripper1138 » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 7:28 PM UTC

whytaka wrote: post #59

Personally, I have lost hope. The ocean temperatures will continue rising, the ecosystem of micro-organisms that provide the majority of the planet's oxygen will collapse, the seasons will become completely undependable for agriculture, the massive reservoirs of methane under permafrost will explode into the atmosphere, forests around the world will burn, and the reservoirs of potable water will dry up. My cynical be…

Read up on some real science and geography. Earth has been much warmer in the past and there was still plenty of oxygen. warmer also means wetter (in general). Local climates may change quickly but there will still going to be plenty of water, oxygen, and life.

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#313

Post by swader999 » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 7:28 PM UTC

bwship wrote: post #223

rgbrenner wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cold records being broken are less frequent than in the past. Pretending that 1 cold record being broken disproves global warming is just the kind of disingenuous argument that deniers make. Figures 1-4: https://www.epa.gov/climate-indicators/climate-change-indica... https://www.climatesignals.org/data/record-high-temps-vs-rec... https://www.axios.com/climate-change-warm-cold-temperature-r... https://phys.org/news/20…

What am I denying? That it is a hot summer. Or that I don't believe in climate change. For one, the records for temperature only go back a 100 years or so, so I would call it statistically insignificant. But, secondly, I truly would like to know what us as a people are actually going to do about it? Nobody on HN is going to give up their devices, or stop buying crypto that uses massive amounts of energy to produce. I…

It only matters what China and India do. We aren't emitting enough where reductions matter in relation to those two.

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#314

Post by throwaway483284 » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 7:29 PM UTC

Around 10 years ago when I was telling everyone what will happen soon (floods, wild fires, heat waves etc) people looked at me like I'm some kind of lunatic. These days the same people ask me what I think about the future. Few years ago I believed we can still win with climate change but now I'm certain that we will not. Problem is in the fundamentals of our current economic model that is based on infinite growth, which keeps society stable. General population social hierarchy of values is also a huge obstacle, what's going on Instagram is a huge indicator of that. Most people care but not enough to justify lifestyle change. I was very unhappy and worried a lot about what future will bring and that we are not doing enough to stop it, but now I'm relieved and happy, because I've accepted that this will happen either way and I can't do anything about it more than what I'm doing already. This will be controversial advice on HN but here it goes.. if you are miserable because of climate change and you constantly fear of future just let it go, you can't control the future. Not everyone needs to be a hero, live you life, spend time with your love ones, do what makes you happy, be kind to others, try to not consume too much so you don't contribute to climate change and plan accordingly.

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#315

Post by bpodgursky » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 7:29 PM UTC

orf wrote: post #37

gruez wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As much as this is (anti?) virtue-signaling, it's not really a contributor to global warming. Idling the engine for a minute or two probably causes more co2 emissions. The main concern is the particulate emissions.

It’s not the act itself, it’s the fact that there is a segment of the population that will spend thousands of dollars to modify their cars to pollute more, so that they can try and humiliate people driving hybrid and electric cars. That’s a symptom of a much, much deeper problem.

I mean, sure, it's dumb, but choosing to take a weekend flight to Vail to hit the slopes emits more carbon than a year of rolling coal, and nobody is seriously trying to crack down on recreational travel.

I think the deeper problem is that even "concerned" people have emissions deeply baked into their lifestyles but don't realize it because they check all the right cosmetic boxes.

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#316

Post by actually_a_dog » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 7:29 PM UTC

sva_ wrote: post #190

SigmundA wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of the deniers I know have shifted from it doesn't exist to either its not man made and just a natural cycle or it may actually be a good thing because plants like CO2 and warmth...

Don't forget the camp of people who say "It exists, and we're past the point at which we can do something about it." I have to say, that on some days I almost feel like I share that mindset, as the promise of democracy that I was raised up on does not seem to bear fruits. It feels like people have learned to game the system too well.

I'm more or less in this camp. I definitely believe we technically could do something about climate change. But, when I think about the sheer scale of collective action it would take, combined with the fact that we can't even get a sizeable portion of Americans to exercise common sense public health measures to deal with a pandemic, that's when the doom & gloom mentality sets in for me.

This is not typically my public stance; I would very much like for us to do something about it. I'm just afraid that even that amounts to wishful thinking these days.

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#317

Post by CyanBird » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 7:29 PM UTC

Koshkin wrote: post #163

From Wikipedia: The climate of the Jurassic was generally warmer than that of present, by around 5 °C to 10 °C, with atmospheric carbon dioxide likely four times higher. Forests likely grew near the poles...

Yep, yep

Wherever happens the planet will continue, same can't be said for modern human civilization on said new climatic landscape, wheat, corn, and other plants staple foods just didn't exist back then and heck knows if we'd be able to keep cultivating them with such different weather patterns and co2 amounts

I believe tho, that rsther than you quoting the jurassic, you ought quote the Permian triassic event, that's certainly more apt for how abrupt current atmospheric changes are

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#318

Post by LeifCarrotson » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 7:29 PM UTC

pessimizer wrote: post #200

SigmundA wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of the deniers I know have shifted from it doesn't exist to either its not man made and just a natural cycle or it may actually be a good thing because plants like CO2 and warmth...

There is a severely underestimated group of religious people who think that only God controls the weather, His reasons for what he does with it are not for you to evaluate, and that saying that humans can change the weather is blasphemy. It's easy to make fun of, but the most direct experience that people have of a God who controls the universe would be the weather. These people need to be approached theologically; s…

The good news is (no, not that Good News) that education and information are working to reduce the influence of this group. See [1] and [2] for some survey data and [3] for some more discussion, [1] in particular indicates that church membership has just this year crossed below the 50% mark. Also, it's strongly age-correlated; 58% of Boomers are members but only 36% of millenials are members, so as time moves on this trend will continue. Note that these surveys are often influenced by a strong halo effect where people conditioned as children that they ought to be more religious answer that they attend church more often than they do and that they hold beliefs that they believe to be virtuous but do not actually think are true, so I expect the actual numbers are significantly stronger for this trend.

Also, "PMCs"? A search suggests "Professional-managerial class" for the acronym, but I wasn't familiar with that. Is an engineer or a programmer considered to be in the PMC?

[1]: https://news.gallup.com/poll/341963/church-membership-falls-...

[2]: https://www.pewforum.org/2019/10/17/in-u-s-decline-of-christ...

[3]: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/its-not-just-young-whit...

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#319

Post by UncleOxidant » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 7:29 PM UTC

linuxhansl wrote: post #303

Imagine an asteroid would be on trajectory to collide with earth in (say) 2025. Possible order of hypothetical events: 1. Scientist discover the asteroid. Calculate risk of collision. 2. Asteroid comes closer, probability of impact is calculated as high. 3. People will start saying that we cannot let our economy be controlled by the specter of an asteroid. 4. The asteroid becomes visible. You can see it with your bar…

Given the experience of the last couple of years, I think this would be a very plausible scenario. And we'd deserve to go extinct like the dinosaurs did.

Re: It’s official: July was Earth’s hottest month on record

#320

Post by fr2null » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 7:29 PM UTC

csense wrote: post #273

Shouldn't climate change have both negative and positive effects? For example, people don't want to live in the Rust Belt because the winters are too cold. Could the region's economic viability increase if winters get milder? In some places, climate change makes things worse for growing crops, makes people need to move out, or increases the probability of disasters. Everyone is talking about this. In other places, cl…

I'm not even anything close to a climate expert, but I can imagine that this is because most of the world lives in places that are livable in our current climate.

Most of us don't live in Siberia or Greenland. Sure these places might become great because of climate change, but it doesn't matter, since barely anyone lives there.

In the places were we do live, the temperatures are already (semi) ok, meaning that increasing these temperatures will bother more people than it will help.

Furthermore, most people live close to water, which means a rising sea level will be bad for them. Maybe (probably not, but just imagine that) after the sea level has risen we have more viable land that is close to water. However, at that point all the current cities have been ruined by it, because they were built for the old water levels.