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Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires

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Re: Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires

#51

Post by mdp2021 »

endisneigh wrote: post #49

I have no problem with billionaires personally. I do have a problem with people being billionaires if the "value" they've created is negative (obviously this is my opinion). Consider two billionaries: - One creates a cold nuclear fusion device the size of a 10" x 10" x 10" cube. You can plug anything to this device and it will power it, indefinitely. - Another gets little boys and girls addicted to some sort of super…

You seem to be implying that governments should be more attentive in taxing externalities.

Re: Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires

#52

Post by CodesInChaos »

ksdakfasdf wrote: post #44
jonfw wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's say I start a Saas company and it does really well. Somebody offers to invest at a valuation of 25$ million bucks. By most standards of evaluation net worth- I'm worth $25 million bucks now. who seizes ownership of my company? What's to stop me from offering you $10 bucks for .0001% of your company and making you illegally rich? Taxes on net worth won't work because net worth is abstract

It's abstract until it isn't. Is the offer to invest 25$ million abstract?

The offer is to invest 2.5M in exchange for 10% of the company. There is no offer to buy all your shares for 25M.

Re: Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires

#53

Post by AnIdiotOnTheNet »

jonfw wrote: post #24
david927 wrote: post #3

Until there's a wealth floor -- until everyone is fed, sheltered and has access to education, there needs to be a wealth cap. We, as a collective humanity, should not allow anyone to have more than, say, $20 million, until the basic needs of others have been met.

Let's say I start a Saas company and it does really well. Somebody offers to invest at a valuation of 25$ million bucks. By most standards of evaluation net worth- I'm worth $25 million bucks now. who seizes ownership of my company? What's to stop me from offering you $10 bucks for .0001% of your company and making you illegally rich? Taxes on net worth won't work because net worth is abstract

The tax could be such that you are forced to turn over shares in the company to the state. The bigger you get, the more shares you have to give to them, the more influence they have on company decisions.

In theory, this would act sort of as a general purpose regulation. Instead of using the force of law to make companies comply, it uses the force of its share votes.

Of course, there are a bunch of ways this kind of scheme could go wrong too.

Re: Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires

#54

Post by david927 »

simonh wrote: post #32
david927 wrote: post #3

Until there's a wealth floor -- until everyone is fed, sheltered and has access to education, there needs to be a wealth cap. We, as a collective humanity, should not allow anyone to have more than, say, $20 million, until the basic needs of others have been met.

The problem with that is not really to do with equality, it's to do with who runs companies and where investment in the economy comes from, and how everyone's basic needs are met. This would take the ownership of huge swathes of the companies in the world out of the hands of the people who created them and operate them and into the hands of random executives with little or no track record. You're not going to meet an…

Yes, that's a problem. But it's not as big a problem as the current economic divide. The very wealthiest have superfluous amounts of money -- enough to pay to find loopholes so that they pay no taxes.

If there was an island with 100 people and one person had almost all of the coconuts and others were starving, no one will care about details for very long. Fix it now because people won't ask nicely for long.

Re: Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires

#55

Post by dcolkitt »

david927 wrote: post #3

Until there's a wealth floor -- until everyone is fed, sheltered and has access to education, there needs to be a wealth cap. We, as a collective humanity, should not allow anyone to have more than, say, $20 million, until the basic needs of others have been met.

Imposing a wealth cap like that is a fantastic way to assure that those basic needs will never be met.

Over the past two centuries, billions of humans have been lifted out of poverty. Approximately zero percent of that came from the redistribution of existing wealth. All of it came from raising economic productivity. And that vast majority of those productivity gains had foundations built by entrepreneurs seeking great fortunes.

Re: Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires

#56

Post by jppope »

yayr wrote: post #45

This may be unpopular, but the hard thing in this discussion is to differentiate between consumption and investment. It does not help much to take wealth in terms of equity paper money away from people who know how to invest it efficiently and distribute it. On the other hand, there are minimum basic needs for consumption of food, health services, shelter, education etc. I agree that the system to finance those servi…

> "the hard thing in this discussion is to differentiate between consumption and investment" Indeed. Even harder is to acknowledge our government already has enough tax money, and further tax revenue will not be used prudently, in the best interest of our country.

Re: Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires

#57

Post by adam12 »

MichaelRazum wrote: post #40

Honestly so much time is spent on taxes. In terms of avoiding, discussing and modifying. Will there ever be a simple and easy solution?

We could start by overturning "Citizens United". I don't have any hope for that happening any time soon.

Re: Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires

#59

Post by [deleted] »

randomhodler84 wrote: post #5
david927 wrote: post #3

Until there's a wealth floor -- until everyone is fed, sheltered and has access to education, there needs to be a wealth cap. We, as a collective humanity, should not allow anyone to have more than, say, $20 million, until the basic needs of others have been met.

The problem is that inflation destroys the value of money quicker than you realize. Nice houses can cost $30M in alpha cities. $20M is a goal post that will need to be moved regularly. It’s too difficult to say what is “enough”.

[deleted]

Re: Millionaires call for an emergency tax on billionaires

#60

Post by david927 »

mkotowski wrote: post #25
david927 wrote: post #3

Until there's a wealth floor -- until everyone is fed, sheltered and has access to education, there needs to be a wealth cap. We, as a collective humanity, should not allow anyone to have more than, say, $20 million, until the basic needs of others have been met.

Okay, so then people will start to invest in gold. A cap on raw materials? Let’s keep a herd of cattle or two. And ad nauseam . As someone from a post-communist country: when you put a limit on capital, another form of accumulating one will be created. Some people will be more able and motivated to get the new form of the value, others will be less able or simply not interested in it, some will inherit it over time.…

We have taxes now; this would be a wealth tax.
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