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The Moment Of Truth For Airbnb As User’s Home Is Utterly Trashed

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Re: The Moment Of Truth For Airbnb As User’s Home Is Utterly Trashed

#231
post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whoa. Good point. Shit just got real. Thanks for creeping me out even further.

The risk has always been there. Have you ever seen/used a lock-pick gun? They'll open anything non-specialized in less than a second. Failing that, a lightly skilled (50h practice) lock-picker can open most household locks, even "secure" ones, in under fifteen minutes. Beyond that, the lock/deadbolt/wall is pretty weak. A sledge hammer will open almost any door in a single blow. Windows are essentially just big gapin…

Entry certainly isn't the problem.

Authorized entry is, and in the case of AirBnB you've got a case where someone's contracted for entry, may have notified neighbors / building management that strangers will be present, etc. (though "hey, strangers will be present, would you mind looking in on things might have been another good practice for EJ).

Your points on locks are very well made, and there's a long Internet (and pre-Internet) history of attempts at censorship by lockmakers against picking methods.

Phone books? How archaic. I don't have a landline -> no phone book entry. My information might be accessible elsewhere, but my perimeter security systems are quite good, and Krell steel resists mosts assaults.

Your idea of "unethical" (to say the least of good business sense) is markedly different from mine.

Re: The Moment Of Truth For Airbnb As User’s Home Is Utterly Trashed

#232
post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

legitimate insurance companies Sounds like an oxymoron to me...

No, most insurance companies are perfectly legitimate. You are confusing 'legitimate' with 'morally sound'. Which is not to say I agree that that would be an oxymoron. A 'morally sound free market' or 'morally sound unregulated capitalism': those are oxymorons, because there is no imperative that causes unbridled competition in free markets to lead to companies doing 'the right thing'. Which is why we need a governme…

Insurance companies are immoral?

My employer and I pay $7,500 a year for my health insurance. I developed a debilitating back condition which required over $150,000 in surgery and therapy. My cost? Less than $1,000.

A friend of the family was killed in a tragic accident. He left behind a wife with a long-term debilitating illness and 3 children. Several life insurance policies paid sufficient monies that they have the financial resources to live their lives.

Re: The Moment Of Truth For Airbnb As User’s Home Is Utterly Trashed

#233
post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, most insurance companies are perfectly legitimate. You are confusing 'legitimate' with 'morally sound'. Which is not to say I agree that that would be an oxymoron. A 'morally sound free market' or 'morally sound unregulated capitalism': those are oxymorons, because there is no imperative that causes unbridled competition in free markets to lead to companies doing 'the right thing'. Which is why we need a governme…

Insurance companies are immoral? My employer and I pay $7,500 a year for my health insurance. I developed a debilitating back condition which required over $150,000 in surgery and therapy. My cost? Less than $1,000. A friend of the family was killed in a tragic accident. He left behind a wife with a long-term debilitating illness and 3 children. Several life insurance policies paid sufficient monies that they have th…

I assume this reply was intended for my parent, because I was not arguing that companies were immoral.

I do argue that companies are essentially amoral: outside of governments, the only force working on them is the pressure to survive in the face of competition, using whatever means needed to achieve that goal. The only reason companies generally behave in morally acceptable ways is by government regulation. Without those, monopolies on drinking water, oil and other essentials would be acquired and enforced by companies with armies. But the net effect of the current state of affairs is that companies generally behave in morally acceptable ways.

Re: The Moment Of Truth For Airbnb As User’s Home Is Utterly Trashed

#234
I rented an upstair room to a backpacker a month ago in Saigon Vietnam. On his last day, he picked up some chick off the street, brought her home and locked the front door from the inside. My staff ( I have an online bookstore there) couldn't get in for half a day. I sent airbnb a message complaining and heard nothing back from them. I don't think it is that hard to hold a credit card number of the guest just in case stuff like this happens. Why they are not doing it is beyond me.

Re: The Moment Of Truth For Airbnb As User’s Home Is Utterly Trashed

#235
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two-sided marketplaces are perfect when all actors are reasonable, but upon mainstream adoption many services invite whole range of unreasonable actors. Services that exist in a known niche probably can't scale the way that mass-market services can, but the actors are probably far more predictable.

This is why AirBnB will never be the ebay of spaces like they aspire to be. Our personal spaces are always at risk with AirBnB unlike product transactions on Ebay.

Actually I think there are a lot of parallels with eBay. I remember the very early days of that service, when there was a lot of interpersonal communication, transactions were friendly, you could send personal checks without raising an eyebrow, etc. When it became mainstream, all that went away very quickly.

I remember the first time I got screwed on an eBay transaction I thought it was just a random, unfortunate thing -- "well, I've been using this a lot, I guess it was bound to happen." Then it happened again. Pretty quickly I realized that things were going downhill, and the trust I'd put in other users of the service was no longer reasonable.

I think that's the direction that AirBnB is headed, unless they take steps to intentionally restrict their growth and remain in a niche market. Eventually they'll have to do what eBay has done, and make the transactions as anonymous and automated as possible, and probably push all but the big commercial operations (who can absorb the fraud risk that gets pushed onto sellers) out of the market.

But the upside is, I think there's a market for services like AirBnB that are still niche. As AirBnB grows and becomes less and less pleasant to do business with, and as the risk involved in every transaction grows (as it did with eBay), there's an opportunity for someone to create a competitor that's tailored to a specific niche market. Or maybe one that's built on top of a social network, so that you're always renting from a friend of a friend or something. There are a lot of possibilities I could imagine.

But AirBnB seems to be going for mass-market adoption and I think that's the death of a friendly, trusting community if it involves money.

Re: The Moment Of Truth For Airbnb As User’s Home Is Utterly Trashed

#238
post #8

When someone first told me about AirBnB I immediately dismissed it - just like Fred Wilson did. It fell in the group of ideas which I just find puzzling because the concept is totally alien to something I would want to do/buy/participate in. I don't get why anyone would want to rent out their couch or spare room to a transient stranger - even 'vetted' within a community (and we can see that vetted is very lose here)…

"When someone first told me about AirBnB I immediately dismissed it - just like Fred Wilson did. It fell in the group of ideas which I just find puzzling because the concept is totally alien to something I would want to do/buy/participate in."

I felt the same way about Ebay. How would you guarantee you didn't get junk shipped to you by some individual who changes his ID every day? How would you make sure that the top bidders actually go through on their agreement? The whole things seemed shaky. But it seems to have worked out for them.

Re: The Moment Of Truth For Airbnb As User’s Home Is Utterly Trashed

#239
post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Such an insurance would probably be pretty much impossible. If you get a legit HTBRAI ( house trashed by random asshole insurance ), you've automatically created a market where these HTBRAIs are priced, bought and sold. That means you are essentially gaming burglary. eg. if I buy 100 HTBRAIs in some dicey neighborhood and there's an incident, my contracts automatically go up in value. That's a huge incentive for crim…

you're mistaking the insurance with risk swap contracts, options, CDS and the likes. The insurance is when you own the interest in the property subject to the risk you're insuring against and the limit of the insurance payment is generally the amount of the actual market value/damage/replacement cost to your interest in the property. Thus it is illegal to double(triple...) insure in order to receive double(triple...)…

"you're mistaking the insurance with risk swap contracts, options"

No I'm not. btw i trade options & risk swaps for a living, so I had a good laugh reading your mini tutorial on "this is called option, that is called CDS" :) Anyways, there's lots of holes in your explanation. For one, you say it is illegal to double-insure. Not true. It is illegal to double-dip, not double-insure. So you can get health insurance for yourself from your employer & simultaneously be covered by your spouse's employer - this is quite routine and legal, though frowned upon. What is illegal is to bill both the providers for your expenses. Another eg. you double-insure expensive realty, so if one insurance provider goes out of business, you don't have CP risk. But if there's damages to your house, you can recover losses from only one provider, not both.

As an aside, much of this is enforceable because insurance is such a heavily regulated industry, so you have centralized databases & its easy to check if you are double-insured, double-dipping & other edge cases. With HTBRAI, assuming such a thing ever comes into existence, you'd need a framework for all that regulation to fit in, which is what I'm skeptical about. airbnb is a fine service and they have a sound business model & a solid future - these insurance wrinkles will hopefully be ironed out in due course.

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